Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

[dill]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Kayla, I don't usually post here. I don't attend AA but I get a lot out of the discussions on this thread. I just wanted to respond to your post as it was very powerful and moving. You most certainly are struggling with step one. It is probably the biggest hurdle for all of us. I've been on MWO for 6 months now and just this week was the first time I wrote in a post that I am an alcoholic. It is really, really difficult. But if that's what you have to acknowledge and say, in order to get the help you need and start working at it seriously, then that's what you have to do. It's not like you are a criminal! (...borrowing a bit from Mary's analogy, she puts it much better.) You are a recovering alcoholic. That's all. And the only thing worse than being an alcoholic, is being one and not seeking to recover!

Strength to you, and thank you for your powerful and honest sharing.

[momof3]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Kayla,

My heart went out to you when reading your story...it sounds like deep down you know you have a serious problem but there's that voice (some call it "the beast") that is telling you that "it's not all that bad." Know that we all struggle with that voice. It is the diseased part of you brain talking....the part that still wants to be fed.

It sounds like you are struggling with AA and "starting all over again." Find something that works for you right now. Don't drink or drug. Take it a step at a time. There is no way to move forward other than to stop putting these substances in your body.

Look at the toolbox thread here. There is lots of great advice. Check in here.

M3

[ready2change]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Kayla,
I am so sorry you are having such a hard time. We can all relate to that on some level. It sounds to me like you have the classic case of "denial" going on in your head. None of us want to be alcoholics, but if we are, then we are and we can't deny it. But we can learn to live with it and not let it destroy our lives.

I'm not clear why your going to AA? Is it your choice or are you court ordered? I'm sure if your forced to go, it can make it much more difficult to accept. All AA asks for is a "willingness" to get sober and they can help you accomplish that.

If your so uncomfortable with the meetings, have you tried reading any of their literature or the Big Book? I found that extremely helpful. Also, perhaps the particular meeting your attending isn't a "fit" for you? Do you have any others near by that your could try?

Another "classic" element of our disease is to think we're not THAT bad. Of course there will always be others worse than us, but that doesn't make our alcoholism any less so. The sooner you accept that you have a problem with alcohol, the sooner you can begin to get better. Be gentle and patient with yourself, you didn't become an alcohlic overnight and recovery takes practice. Kudos to you for kicking the drugs, now go and kick AL's butt. I'm sure everyone on this thread will welcome you with open arms, everyone's opinion and experience at AA is welcome here.

R2C

[Doggygirl]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Hello everyone! Special Hi to Phil - hope all is OK. Are you still with your brother? (very possible I missed some stuff here...!!) Thinking of you.

Kayla, I am so glad that you posted your conflicting thoughts, and especially that you did it with so much raw honesty.

That addicted part of ourselves LOVES to convince us that we can / should keep right on drinking doesn't it? At least mine does. I spent years in the "I'm not an alkie because I don't live under a bridge and pee on myself" mode. One thing to keep in mind. Unaddicted, normal drinkers do not think about stuff like "I wonder if I'm an alkie? I need to really watch myself and control my drinking... I'm not as bad with drinking and so and so..." IMO, the fact that I think these things at all tells me alll I need to know about my problem.

I completely understand - as Dill said - the admission that we are alkies signals that the "party" is over and my brain too resisted that for a long time.

AA is just one of several programs of recovery. If the battle in your mind is "Am I an alcoholic / problem drinker or not?" then it really doesn't matter what program of recovery (or combination) you participate in, you will probably struggle with any program. So maybe consider that Step One question on it's own merit rather than thinking about it as part of AA? It is a central question to recovery under any program I think.

I applaud you for going at this problem rather than sitting back and ignoring it. I speak from experience when I say that the problem does NOT go away on it's own.

Mean time...

I went to the Saturday AM Big Book study. The main topic today was on the subject of making amends. I am not looking forward to some of those discussions, but after listening to everyone, I AM looking forward to getting some of this baggage off of my chest and behind me. I think it will be freeing. I would love to hear comments from anyone who may have done this step.

It was very nice to be in the room to help celebrate two anniversaries today. One guy with 8 months and another guy with 32 years. It feels comforting to be part of that sort of sober continuum (sp).

Strength to all,

DG

[cpn1004]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Kayla,
I attended 15 AA meetings in May and have similar concerns/questions as you.
I've never had a DUI, both of my bothers and my long deceased Dad had several of them, I am successfully employed, the only person in my family to go to college, get a degree and all that. YET, I ask the same questions you do.
Am I an alcoholic? Has my life become unmanageable?

You know the old joke/truth is "if you think you have a drinking problem, you probably do." I am still working on the answer for me. You are in the right place, there is great help here and maybe AA too.
Love and Peace,
Phil

[Winefree]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Kayla, I too struggle with the what if's, am I really, I'm not that bad etc. But the more I read, Yes, I am. We can all be at different levels, but the problem is there. I am just finishing reading Willpower's Not Enough: Recovering from addictions of every kind. It is by Arnold Washton and Donna Boundy. It is scary how I can see myself in the addictive personalities and some of the addictive thinking that our minds do.It offers many ideas on how to change our life in order to recover from our addictions.
It does have AA info in it, but it all seems to make sense.
Why don't you give it a try.

Winefree

[Kayla]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Thanks to all for making time to give such valuable feedback.

Dill - I got your return post, within 5 mins of posting, so it was great to get such immediate reality checking. Like I thought, most def a 1st step problem - and as DG pointed out, absolutely, crucially, the most central question... and the one I've been wrestling with for ... feels like forever.

Top point DG: people without drinking problems aren't found sitting around asking themselves whether they're alcoholics or not. Of course, lots of people also normalise their (actually problematic) drinking - and that's where I trip up - when I follow their lead. I've had friends say "Don't worry, I too drink every night". I conveniently overlook that they have unfinished bottles of wine in their fridges. There are never any dregs in mine. I like what Stephen King says about his alcoholic past, namely that if he left any alcohol over at the end of the night, it would call out to him, relentlessly, until he got up and finished it off. And in that spirit, I will bear in mind that there is no other way fwd than to ditch the substances, M3, and try and unpack that toolbox you mentioned.

R2C - No I don't have to go to AA - only me dragging my arse there - and being a lover of keeping all this recovery stuff very cerebral, I have indeed read and highlit the Big Book and frankly, my shelves are full of the stuff - like I said to you DG, it's all there - all the tips, all the strategies. I just keep getting stalled on: Do I have a problem? The perpetual "What if/Am I" biggie that WF talks of. Very, very good advice to isolate the question - to pare it back and divorce it from AA. Really when all's said and done, I do know the answer. I just don't like what the answer is, and and I keep trying to rewrite it. As for accepting it, that's in the realm of vacillation city. One day I think I've got it, the next I'm asking myself whether I can just drink on Fridays. No wonder AA loves the insanity word. It is just pure crazy, yet blindingly obvious to everyone else.

Clearly, this is going to take some time - it sounds like you Phil are still asking the self-same Q - thanks for reminding me I'm in the right place. I needed to hear that.

For the first time in 8 years, I'm clear though on why I'm going to AA. Not to somehow absorb sobriety through mere attendance. But to make face-to-face contact with others who have decided they want to ABSTAIN from drinking alcohol. I need to be around these people, not debating AAs flaws down at the pub.

Power to all of you for doing this and for helping me to keep on doing it too x

[Kayla]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Forgot ... Winefree ... I'll have a scout around for that book ... one more book can't hurt.
Lastly ... just wanted to say that I'm using AA and MWO - trying to synthesise a workable, Kayla-tailored way to really start dealing with 'the problem'. Yep, that one I sometimes think I don't have.

[paula]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Hi everyone, I have managed to stay sober for a few days. I am going to see my daughter and g/children today, I'm dreading it as the last time I saw them I was really drunk. They have forgiven me,but I will lose them if I carry on drinking, and I can't bear the thoughts. I have been to AA a few times this week, and have greatly benefitted. I just sit and listen and get so much identification it's unbelievable. Good luck Kyla.

[Winefree]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Kayla, not sure if you can order from Amazon.com, but that is where I got the book. I too am trying to work through this with MWO and AA. Oh, I also have a counsellor as well. I'm just new at the AA thing and haven't gone through the steps with a sponsor yet. Doing a lot of listening, reflection, reading and soul searching. Staying AF ODAT and enjoying the clear head feeling in the mornings.

Paula, good for you, keep it up, you can DO IT>
Winefree

[Doggygirl]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Hi everyone! The last 24 hours has been exhausting emotionally, but a time of reflection and some much needed self honesty. I had lunch with my long time friend and college room mate yesterday. We have maintained contact over the last 30+ years - sometimes more than other times - but have never completely lost touch. Our friendship is one where we have both shared some very intimate secrets that literally nobody else knows. And yet I have tried to keep this friend at arms length.

We had a nice visit yesterday and did lots of catching up. I was honest with her about my battle with alcoholism, and "how it was" over the last 10 years especially of my drinking. She listened with understanding and love as she has always done. What I realized last night is that she is one of the very, very few people in my life who has consistently offered me unconditional love. And I have shit on her many times. It's one thing when I realize that my self will has hurt me. It's a totally different thing to see with clarity how my self will has hurt someone else, and she loves me unconditionally anyway. I will have some significant amends to make with her when I reach that point. I can't imagine how I will ever truly make things right, but I will try.

And this situation showed me more about why I need to run on the HP's will than on my own. I'm sure I will go through the steps again and again over time. For this time, I have officially done step 3 with a firm decision to turn my will over. I truly believe I am capable of being a much kinder, more loving and giving human being than what I have become with a little help from AL.

Kayla I had to smile at your line

I need to be around these people, not debating AAs flaws down at the pub.

:H Boy isn't that the truth!

I was thinking this morning about how people think the "character defects" identification process of AA is about kicking you when you're already down. It's really not. It's about looking HONESTLY in the mirror and asking for help to become a better person. None of are perfect and never will be. We can only work to do better. I felt good this morning to be sitting around the table with so many people who are honest and good, and getting better in every sense of the word - mentally, physcially, etc.

Today's meeting was on Tradition 3. (The only requirement for membership in AA is a desire to stop drinking) What a great meeting is was discussion the non-descrimination aspects of AA. Many of the old timers had stories of times when Tradition 3 had been violated. However, BECAUSE tradition 3 exists, those wrongs get righted eventually, and AA is probably one of most non-descriminatory programs anywhere. Way better than the garbage I saw in the corporate world, that's for sure! We talked about some situations that have occured in our own club (the club owns / manages the facilities but the AA groups that meet there are autonomous per AA guidelines). Where fear based intolerance has reared it's head, things eventually have been righted through the traditions.

If you have the book 12 Steps and 12 Traditions (I recommend that for anyone who decides to start actively working the steps) on page 140 there is a reference to beggars, tramps, asylum inmates, prisoners, queers, plain crackpots and fallen women. That sums up the group that the original AAers wanted to protect themselves against. Good thing that went by the wayside or there are a couple of categories that would have kept me out LOL!!!! (and I'm not saying which ones!)

I keep hearing that the book "AA Comes of Age" is an excellent read about the history. That's definitely going on my list of stuff to read for enjoyment! This "student mode" is making this very old brain HURT!!

Well, that's the update for now. My head is very full, but it's all good. I feel like I am experiencing some personal growth and I know for sure it wouldn't be possible if AL were still my constant companion.

DG

[CS04]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

DG, I have a friend like that too (also my college roommate) who knows of my struggles with AL, and also knows of my recent attempts to fix them thru MWO. Well since I haven't fixed them, I am afraid to call her, because I feel like I have failed (I am starting to cry as I type this). But I know she loves me as much as your friend loves you. I have really been isolating myself from friends and family over the last year.

[ready2change]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

I attended a Speaker meeting this morning. It was one I attended a few weeks ago, at which time it was a bit more lively than today. Last time there were a couple of speakers, today just one. It never ceases to amaze me how raw and open these people are that share their lives with us. They open up with total strangers about how alcohol has effected their lives, never holding anything back. They do this in hopes that we may see that admitting your powerlessness over alcohol can lead to a life that includes sobriety. The humility it takes to sit in front of everyone and share with them still blows me away.

A woman approached me after the meeting and asked if I would like to take her phone number. She said she would be happy to drive me to a meeting, or just meet me for coffee or just talk anytime I felt like it. Now being an alcoholic who has basically excluded having friends or close relationships with anyone other than AL..this is both comforting an uncomfortable at the same time? Does that make any sense? I still have that nagging bit of hesitation to allow anyone to help me...that stinkin drinking thinkin that I can do this on my own, simply by coming to MWO and reading and occasionally posting, and reading lots of books on how not to be an alkie. But you know what, I can't. I have been giving sobriety a serious go for almost 2yrs now, and althought I am WAYYY better than I have ever been, I'm nowhere near where I want to be. So, something isn't working, obviously. And I am going to let these people in to my inner world and see if I can find the peace and serenity that they have found. I have nothing to lose and everything to gain by this.

I was pondering all the talk that goes around these boards about wishing and hoping to someday be a "normal" drinker, whether that means modding or what. And I was thinking how that NEVER applies to me. I only want to drink to get drunk...and then pass out. Lots of fun, huh? I don't even like the taste of alcohol, let alone want to sip it! So, I know without a shred of doubt that I am an alcoholic. And I want to learn how to live sober, not just be sober. Wish me luck friends, and thanks for sharing your experiences.

R2C

[Doggygirl]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Hi again CS and R2C. Boy I can relate so closely with both of your posts right now. CS, I think I know exactly what you mean about isolating yourself. That really defined my life for the last 10 years with all. I withdrew from the world, and started resently each and every worldly intrusion because it interfered with my drinking.

Because I have drank so heavily for my whole adult life, AL has touched everything with his poison pen. R2C I think I can relate to you too - wanting to open up to new friends to fully share this experience and then heal and grow from it - but being a little scared to. CS I realize I was never as fully engaged with my friend I mentioned as I thought I was, or as she has been with me. Opening myself up to another human fully and completely. I don't even think I'm there (in fact I know I'm not) with Mr. Doggy. It's scary. On Saturday one woman described her HP as the safety net below her as she stepped out into all of this new, emotional territory when she first quit drinking. I'm not completely confident that the safety net is there yet, but I can sure relate to the fear of falling as I venture forth into feeling things and considering relationships both new and old.

I'm with you R2C. I WANT to feel things fully and to take emotional risks and to love and be loved. Going it alone ain't all it's cracked up to be. Even MWO keeps me at a safe distance and while MWO is very , very valuable to my sobriety, AA is where I feel vulnerable. It's scary and exciting at the same time.

CS my heart goes out to you. I hope you find your way out.

DG

[retteacher]

Weekly AA Thread - Week of June 1 - June 7

Kayla: The decision to immerse yourself into AA is entirely up to you. Plenty of people have stopped drinking wo/AA. I struggle w/the "am I an alcoholic?" question from time to time. In fact, I just had that discussion w/my sponsor this AM. I've never had a DUI, lost anyone's love, a job, etc. I've been functional & then some. However, drinking severely impacted my physical, emotional, & spiritual well-being. It wasn't how much I drank (though I did put away a lot during my binges), it was how AL affected me. I don't want it in my life any more. I'm much, much better wo/it. I go to AA 1. because I hear something helpful, if not inspiring every time I go &2. most importantly, I would drink if I didn't go.

As far as the 1st step. I took it, because I KNOW I'm powerless over AL if I have the very first sip. Once I do that, I'm off & running. I cannot stop drinking after that. My life was unmanageable, because instead of thinking about my family & my work etc., I was thinking about how to have my next drinking session...not to mention the unmanageability of dealing w/hangovers.

Everyone: I'm here & dealing w/nurses, soc. workers, & my mother. I'm doing OK, because I have been going to meetings. Don't worry about me...I'll admit I thought about drinking but wouldn't ever act on it. I have strategies for when I have those thoughts.

I'll try to be back next week. I have oral surgery on Mon. (it's minor), so maybe later in the day or Tues.

I'm going to a meeting now.

Love, Mary