Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

[Doggygirl]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

Catch, thank you for getting us started on the Forward to the Fourth (current) edition. I like that part you point out about "we are people who would normally not mix." It really is interesting how that was written by a group that was actually quite homogenous compared to the mix of people in AA today.

There is a black man I see often who learned how to read after joining AA. He became a good student of AA history and speaks often of the painful evolution in AA as the organization worked to practice what it preached. It is in our very nature, I think, to fear what we do not know or understand. There has been quite a shift happening over the last several months at the Club where I attend many AA meetings regardling the homeless. I used to attend meetings all the time with homeless AA members. Recently there have been none. This saddens me greatly and motivates me to do what I can to give voice and representation to those who for now, are being left out of these particular AA meetings. Will there ever be a time when as a society, we are truly accepting and tolerant of all other people, regardless of race, sex, religion, socio-economic status, sexual preference, etc.? Or will there always be a new fear that serves to separate us?

I love the last sentence of this forward as it reminds me of My Way Out.

Modem-to-modem or face-to-face, AA's speak the language of the heart in all its power and simplicity.

I think for me, there will always be more growth opportunity. I hope I always see that as a positive!

DG

[retteacher]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

DG: I was struck by that "wouldn't ordinarily mix" phrase when we went to that anniversary last week. Many, many guys! Especially many of the rough & ready variety. However, I felt comfortable among them & knew most of them. Sometimes I feel a little mom/grandma-like to them, but that's fine. Whatever works. Mary

PS: We have many homeless who come to meetings. It's wonderful, because I've seen a few of them "graduate" to their own homes. How else can they get their share of the AA program??? Usually underneath edicts & prohibitions is fear. I wonder what the board of directors is afraid of?

[Doggygirl]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

Mary, they are afraid that the homeless people, especially the ones who are still drinking and very unkempt, will "scare others away." IMO, it's wrong. Much of what is going on is out of my control. But I have the courage to change what I can, and there are a couple things I am doing with the input of my sponsor. I also realize I have gotten a bit too comfy attending the same meetings in the same place most of the time. It will be good to branch out a little.

DG

[Cherbear]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

Just ready the forward to the 4th and I was also struck by the modem to modem , how great technology is when is can serve the kind of purpose MWO and AA online serves. There are so many horrible things on the internet that at least I can see balance in that and try and not get to angry about all the ugliness that the internet can bring.
So many people who live remotely can have immediate conversations, unlike way back when the BB was written and they talk about writing letters when they live remotely and wait for a response!

[retteacher]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

DG: I too want to branch out & attend some different meetings. Our Sun. group is starting "committments." These are trips to other groups to tell our stories. I plan to go along & tell mine (for what it's worth). That will be pushing the envelope for me a little bit.

One of my groups has many, many characters who attend. I have never felt that I had to leave, because someone has been to jail or doesn't dress the way I do. Yes, I might have felt a little uncomfortable when there isn't someone "like me" there. But, that's my problem not theirs. I try to remember the acronym HOW: Honesty, Openness, Willingness. We're all equal in the eyes of HP.

Mary

[Doggygirl]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

Yes Mary - I'm working on STOPPING to think whenever I feel uncomfortable. I usually try to lay that discomfort at the feet of somebody else, when really it's me. The good news is that I *can* change me. I cant' change other people. So by working on my own thinking I can remove many of my discomforts one by one. It's empowering.

Cher, I can't imagine going back to the days of waiting for letters!! But that's what people did. At the International in San Antonio, I went to a meeting about AA and the internet. The meeting was led by a panel of mostly very young people. They focused mainly on social media and AA, with anonymity being a key topic. And here I was expecting a discussion of forums more like this one. :H I felt old fashioned. I'm not a big FB user mainly because here, I can be myself 100% (re: discussing recovery) and I feel I have to keep it generic on FB. What fun is that?

I hope everyone who wants to read along is doing so. Are we ready to move on to "The Doctor's Opinion?" xxv to xxxii. Here is the link to the Big Book on line for anyone coming in new to this thread. Big Book Online Fourth Edition

DG

[retteacher]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

DG: I read the Doctor's Opinion ASAP. Mary

[mylife]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

Hi All, I'd like to join in if that's okay. I have a copy of the Big Book that I've read through several times. It's good reading when trying to find some inspiration. I'm not currently attending meetings as it didn't really work for me, but I think the literature is great. Day 4 AF for me.

[retteacher]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

Last night I read the Doctor's Opinion. The 2 words that struck me were:
-allergy
-craving

I certainly had an allergy of the body. I couldn't drink (to excess) wo/getting sick &/or blacking out. If a food made me that sick, I'd avoid it completely. However, the craving part of the addiction kept me coming back for more.

I also identified w/the notion that my mind got enmeshed in the idea that I HAD to have alcohol in order to have any kind of ease w/people or deal w/my problems. I didn't know that I could do that sober. Now that I have a few 24 hours, I know I can. If I drink, it's because I'm choosing to NOT because I have to.

Mary

[Doggygirl]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

Mylife, you are very welcome to join in. AA membership or participation is not necessary. Good to have you with us! I too find the Big Book very interesting in and of itself. It offers a historical perspective on this affliction that I had never studied from any other source.

Mary, I like your comments about the "allergy." Indeed - if a food made me a fraction as sick as I was when drinking I would avoid it! Crazy.

I like this line from Dr. Silkworth too. "The sensation is so elusive that while they admit it is injurious, they cannot after a time differentiate the true from the false." That reminds me of the "voices" who like to try to convince me that things will be different this time. That I CAN control it. That "just one" is OK. Etc. That is all 100% false for me, and yet for years I thought it was true.

This section also highlights for me the frustration that doctors then, and doctors now must go through with such a baffling affliction that THEY cannot really control either.

Another thing I like about this chapter is that I believe it highlights the willingness of early AA's to work WITH the medical community. I think that is very grass roots AA. Some AA's seem opposed to accepting a medical partnership and the use of anti craving meds, etc. I don't think an "either/or" approach was suggested by the founders at all.

A woman I attend meetings with who has been 29 quite a bit longer than me tells a story about alcoholism in her family. It has been rampant through the generations. Her maternal grandparents were both alcoholics. Her grandfather died young, and her grandmother was hopeless. There was nothing else to do with her but commit her to an asylum. I guess she was in and out of asylums for most of her adult life. That was the only "solution" back then. I'm grateful times have changed and there are so many options available today for recovery. I think of this woman's story about her grandmother whenever I read about the pre-AA days and how hopeless things really were for so many alcoholics.

DG

[catch22]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

For me Doctors Opinion i had to read this a few times for it to sink in ! plus it was painful to read just did not want to read the truth.
What stoodout for me was the craving i could understand the craving of the addition, but the allergy took me awhile because it something you cannot see,
I also like the line Dr silkworth DG.... maybe that way i had not like reading the truth...
Also i highlighted the bit.... they are restless irritable and discontented , unless they can again experience the sense of ease and comfort which cames at once by taking a few drinks. i was all three of those before i wanted a drink and then when i was half way through my drinking i would change to a different person get angry or blackout it like the alcohol had change my brain chemistry......
love reading all your post.:h

[retteacher]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

Yes, restless, irritable, & discontented. Those are the perfect adjectives for the way I was when I wasn't drinking...only obsessing about it. Then when I did begin my drinking bout, I was hopeless, defeated, & remorseful. Look at all those negatives! As I look back, I can see so clearly that all that misery was caused by my drinking to excess. Thank God I found a way out. Mary

[j-vo]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

I'm going to jump in here!
I've read this section and after having read everyone's post, those are the parts I've highlighted in my book. I can relate to all of this "doc's opinion." Yes, I can see I have an allergy, because my body doesn't react to alcohol like "normies." My obsession and/or craving with alcohol was so intense, especially when I tried to moderate! When can I drink, only have two, maybe three, only this day or that, can't wait until... I feel free from that! But of course, I believe now that I cannot pick up, and if I do, I'll be back to the insanity. Abstinence is the answer. Oh, one thing I really like, which might be a silly comfort to me..."Then there are the types entirely normal in every respect except in the effect alcohol has upon them. They are often able, intelligent, friendly people." We ain't all that bad!!!!
In fact, if I may add, we are lucky because we are able to look at ourselves honestly now. I think there should be 12 step programs for non-AAer's. The world would be a much lovlier place!

[Cherbear]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

What stands out the most for me reading the Drs opinion and did when I read it the first time was "they were drinking to overcome a craving beyond their mental control" by the end that is the whole of it for me. I no longer wanted to drink.. hated how I felt but the craving was overwhelming. When I went to meetings and started reading the BB for the first time I really was surprised by the fact that not everyone craved alcohol???? I always thought that was just normal. It made me realize more than ever.. after I had tried quitting umpteen times that "the only relief was entire abstinence." Now I have a healthy fear of getting that craving back with 1 sip of wine.

[retteacher]

Book Discussion - Big Book of AA

Cher: As I read your post, I too realize now that my thinking about drinking is very, very different than normal people's thinking. I thought everyone:
-wanted more, more, more.
-wanted to keep the buzz going.
-wanted the effect of drinking not necessarily the taste.
-etc.

Come to find out:
-Normal people STOP drinking when they feel high &/or buzzed.
-Normal people forget about drinking in between drinking opportunities.

Who knew? I didn't.

Mary