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**TheSunFlower** · January 9, 2013, 08:53 PM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

TT...sorry about your news....but, I am curious....since you were sick....would this not be expected? What I mean is if you are actually sick....your liver goes to work. So would your liver levels be expected to be lower?

Thanks...Mick....yes, I was hyper....could you tell?

TDN....I have to re-check out those supplements. I have heard so many good stories here....I'm just tired of paying out $$ for supplements that do nothing.

I did call the doctor's....and I interviewed them. I am not ruling it out.....but, they were talking about a lot of medication. Chemical imbalances. I have had an awful experiece with almost every anti-depressant on the market....so, I doubt I would take them. I literally had to battle to get off of Zoloft that was doing me more harm than good. I just need to think more before I go the medication route.

Did find a good book on Anxiety and Phobias....this seemed to relax me right away. So I am off to read it more.

**CanToo** · January 9, 2013, 11:58 PM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

:l Sun

**CanToo** · January 9, 2013, 11:59 PM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Nicely handled Tree

**kuya** · January 10, 2013, 01:10 AM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Cantoo ..... I said BOLD, honest, must've been a typo! :H:H:H

Evening all.

TT, you can't do any more except diet and I would listen to Det on that one. I had a high meat fat diet and loads of veg whilst drinking a LOT for a long time. Liver fine. I know everyone is different but the nutrition industry has been making us ill for years. Also as well as milk thistle S- ame will help.

SF .... When you start any therapy you will tailspin if you are doing it properly. It is SCARY but stick to it. When I was doing it I would get symptoms of physical illness just before a session, cancelled a couple of times only to immediately 'recover' as soon as the session was cancelled. The body was protecting the mind IMO, not realising the value of the end result. Push through and you will heal......wishing you courage. :h

Going for swim ( kit on Mick so stand down the chopper - helicopter that is! :H)

**Mick** · January 10, 2013, 03:07 AM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Morning all and how is the serious about sobriety section today?all focussed? excellent ..sitting here with a bag of frozen peas round me leg...going out on Sunday so need to get it better..can always have the peas afterwards!!

Right enough woffle..on with the show...tea and coffee on the go

Treetops...sounds to me you are on the way.you described your actions...didnt even think about a drink ..hey poetry man

Well done lass......onions are pretty good with liver too.............boom boom..cheap joke!!! Seriously tho, think it needs to settle down first before jumpiong to any conclusions!

Morning SF....how are you today? calmed down a bit? good....did it show? eh just a wee bit!!..only my opinion now...do you not think you should maybe take things a wee bit slower and see what happens?I dont know..dont know the people you are dealing with so it would be unfair to comment on them or their skills,but give yourself time to breathe...challenge yourself..for instance when things arent right ask yourself why ,how could I change it? could I even change it..might be worth a try

Kuya...aha the fully kitted version....affers to you spoilsport..choppers stood down..oh yeh and Ive cancelled the helicopter! :H how are you today? seem to be getting back to your old self....no no didnt mean old like that..........Slap!!!! ouch and another thing..no one tells jokes as bad as me!!!

Morning TDN...how are you all there?nope no skinny dipping here either!!!its a mere -3 outside this morning with the promise of snow for the weekend..any plans for today? whats on the cards?

Well once again...you did great ,but how did happy hour go at work? did yuo get thru it?hope so...even with all the bs..oh how comes you aint drinking stuff which was bound to happen....Interesting..why is it called happy hour..is it because you can destroy yourself with twice as much at half the price, and be a complete arse too and not remember being a circus act for everyone there?
Hmm Cynicism is a great tool!!!...Did you have a good day off?

Hiya Nurdl..how are you doing ? well did you find your yoga class yesterday?Glad I brighten your day up your post...to remove a pack from your @$$. I think you arent eating those biscuits properly :H have a great day

Meine Sonnenschein.............wilkommenn im irrenhaus !!!! go for it you can do it .Well done on the water ..you are now on day 29... keep going.Where about in Germany are you?I spent quite a bit of my younger days out there..still miss the food..jagerwurst bratties, schnitzels..mmm

Morning Lav...how are you today?now its warmed up you will be sitting outside with your coffee?Hows grandson today? you in a kid free zone today?Liked the bit about this being a serious af land too..yes you are right..as always!!!we have a laff, but the sole purpose is to remain af..the fact we have a laff along the way is a bonus that we have put together between ourselves

Mornin Pauly..how you doing?dont know much about the meds or anything, but think Lav is right, you need to include them in your strategy..just in case side effects etc.What are yuo up to today?anything?

Hiya Det..wowee well done you ..you know I can always tell not by what you post, but how you post how you are...and seems that you are pretty upbeat at the moment , so well done you.Sounds like a nice drive that

Cantoo, how are you? sound pretty busy.......how dare madam say you are old

..Yes I am going to try yoga, once I get my act together..that means bum and leg sorted!!!dont forget your me time in that lot too! have a great day

SL......well now double figures excellent..see told you that you could do it...yep used to go to those meetings quite a lot...found them quite interesting..you wont believe this..but strangely enough , found I used to take quite a few of them over..Another trick I used to do was beforehand, check the previous minutes and find something that I could agenda...when the meeting started try and steer it down that road..its good fun!!, but really goes to show that for the meeting, pro rata outcomes versus time spent is minimal and non productive..politicians do it all the time!!!!

Righty ho cest moi fini..have a great day

My maths teacher asked me a question today at school, ?What comes after 69??
Apparently ? mouthwash ? isn?t the correct answer.

I heard you are looking for someone to build an ark for you? I think i noah guy!

I accidently ate some Christmas decorations the other day and now I have a really sore throat. I went to the doctors and he said it looks like I have tinsel-itus.

Man: Do you think small things are cute?
Woman: Yes
Man: Well that?s a relief because my willy and bank balance are tiny.

I went on a once in a life time holiday.

Never again...

Q: Why did the chicken cross the playground?
A: To get to the other SLIDE!!

A few days after Christmas, a mother was working in the kitchen listening to her young son playing with his new electric train in the living room.
She heard the train stop and her son said, "All of you sons of b*tches who want off, get the hell off now, cause this is the last stop! And all of you sons of b*tches who are getting on, get your asses in the train, cause we're going down the tracks."
The mother went nuts and told her son, "We don't use that kind of language in this house. Now I want you to go to your room and you are to stay there for TWO HOURS. When you come out, you may play with your train, but I want you to use nice language."
Two hours later, the son comes out of the bedroom and resumes playing with his train. Soon the train stopped and the mother heard her son say, "All passengers who are disembarking from the train, please remember to take all of your belongings with you. We thank you for riding with us today and hope your trip was a pleasant one. We hope you will ride with us again soon." She hears the little boy continue, "For those of you just boarding, we ask you to stow all of your hand luggage under your seat. Remember, there is no smoking on the train. We hope you will have a pleasant and relaxing journey with us today."
As the mother began to smile, the child added, "For those of you who are pissed off about the TWO HOUR delay, please see the b*tch in the kitchen."

I was in the restaurant yesterday when I suddenly realized I desperately
needed to pass gas. The music was really, really loud, so I timed my
gas with the beat of the music.

After a couple of songs, I started to feel better. I finished my coffee,
and noticed that everybody was staring at me....

Then I suddenly remembered that I was listening to my iPod.

A man gets home early from work and hears strange noises coming from the bedroom.
He rushes upstairs to find his wife naked on the bed, sweating and panting.
"What's up?" he says.
"I'm having a heart attack," cries the woman.
He rushes downstairs to grab the phone for ambulance, but just as he's dialing, his 4-year-old son comes up and says, "Daddy! Daddy! Uncle Fred is hiding in your closet and he's got no clothes on!"
The man slams the phone down and storms upstairs into the bedroom, past his screaming wife, and rips open the wardrobe door. Sure enough, there is his brother, totally naked, covering on the closet floor.
"You b*stard," the man says," my wife is having a heart attack and you're running around naked scaring the kids!"

A couple of women were playing golf one sunny Saturday morning. The first of the twosome teed off and watched in horror as her ball headed directly toward a foursome of men playing the next hole.
Indeed, the ball hit one of the men, and he immediately clasped his hands together at his crotch, fell to the ground and proceeded to roll around in evident agony.
The woman rushed down to the man and immediately began to apologize. She said, "Please allow me to help. I'm a physical therapist and I know I could relieve your pain if you'd allow."
"Ummph, oooh, nnooo, I'll be all right...I'll be fine in a few minutes," he replied breathlessly as he remained in the fetal position still clasping his hands together at his crotch.
But she persisted, and he finally allowed her to help him. She gently took his hands away and laid them to the side, she loosened his pants,and she put her hands inside. She began to massage him.
She then asked him, "How does that feel?"
To which he replied, "It feels great, but my thumb still hurts like hell."

When NASA first started sending up astronauts, they quickly discovered that ballpoint pens would not work in zero gravity. To combat the problem, NASA scientists spent a decade and $12 billion to develop a pen that writes in zero gravity, upside down, underwater, on almost any surface including glass and at temperatures ranging from below freezing to 300 C.
The Russians used a pencil.

Working people frequently ask retired people what they do to make their days interesting.
Well, for example, the other day my wife and I went into town and went into a shop. We were only in there for about 5 minutes. When we came out, there was a cop writing out a parking ticket. We went up to him and said, "Come on man, how about giving a senior citizen a break?"
He ignored us and continued writing the ticket. I called him a Nazi turd. He glared at me and started Writing another ticket for having worn tires. So my wife called him a ****-head. He finished the second ticket and put it on the windshield with the first. Then he started writing a third ticket. This went on for about 20 minutes. The more we abused him, the more tickets he wrote.
Personally, we didn't care. We came into town by bus.

Have a great day

**kuya** · January 10, 2013, 06:42 AM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

That iPod story wasn't a joke was it Mick? Own up :H:H

Which reminds me of a real story.......

Years ago when my now 23 year old son was only four he used to come to the clinic with me during evening surgery. He would sit behind the counter drawing and chatting with the nurse and clients as they came and went.
One evening we arrived to a packed waiting room. I settled him down with some activities and was just about to call my first client into the consult room. To this day I have no idea what prompted him to stand on his chair so he could see the clients over the desk and announce at the top of his voice

'MY MUM FARTS IN BED! '

Mission accomplished he sat back down and went on drawing. Silence fell.

I opened the consult room door, realised there was no way out of this one and said

'I SURE DO !'

People were in tears laughing.......kids eh? :H

**OnceAgain** · January 10, 2013, 07:07 AM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Mornin TT, SF, Kuya & Mick - Happy Thursday!

Things went well yesterday - still Al Free! However, I got the night of the happy hour wrong - it is tonight! I think I am experiencing the withdrawal symptom where you get spacey and lose your mind! :H So I was all psyched up to be strong and it did not happen. So, I will be even more ready tonight!

SF - I have had very bad anxiety almost all my life and worry about everything. Have panic attacks at times and wake up from sleep with my heart racing, etc. I usually am worrying about something bad happening to people I love (not myself). It is crazy! I went to counseling and was turned on to a book called Radical Acceptance. It is really helpful. You can check it out on Amazon.

Kuya - What a funny story! I have one of my own: Years ago when my older son was 3 we were having a dinner party with my staff at our home (about 10 people). I love to cook! Anyway, Cass goes in to the bathroom which is right off the dining room where we were all eating. A few minutes later he comes out of the bathroom, stands in the hallway with his knickers down bends over and hollers out "wipe my butt!!". I was so embarassed and everyone was laughing till they cried. We tease him about it all the time.

Have a great day everyone!

**Lavande** · January 10, 2013, 08:36 AM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Good Thursday morning Abbers

TT, keep to your plan & you will be fit as a fiddle in no time!

SF, I did my own 'therapy' using an online program called 'Habit Busting' & taking the herbal Supplement Amoryn. I know how awful panic attacks are - don't give up. Keep seraching until you find the right answer for you

Greetings Cantoo, OnceAgain & Kuya!!!

Mick, this warmish weather this week is a true gift. I have no kids here today, they are likely running around in the mud in their own backyard!!
I truly appreciate the love & laughter here, two things that had been missing in my life for so long. Living with a severely & chronically depressed spouse really beats a person down

Staying focused with a lighter heart works for me!!

Well, my 3 yr old son story is -
We were in a dinner sort of place, where you sit in booths & eat breakfast for dinner. My son stood up, put his arms up on the backrest & proceeded to stare at the people sitting in the next booth. I kept telling him to stop & sit down but of course he didn't listen. Then I heard him say "HEY LADY _ YOU UGLY". :H :H
I could have died from sheer embarassment :H

Have a great AF Thursday everyone!
Lav

**scottish lass** · January 10, 2013, 11:52 AM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Morning all - getting cold here, and supposed to get colder - but at least the sun is out, I like cold sunny days - I can day-dream of doing the stuff that CanToo actually does!!
Been invited to a 60th birthday party this weekend - i think I can do it, it is a bit of a drive and my girls are invited too, so think I have enough good reasons not to drink and I am feeling pretty strong. I know there are a couple "thinks" in that sentence, so will be getting my head in gear and will only head down if I change them to "know" I can do it....
Well, off to the grind stone - no meetings today, so good catch up on work planned. 3rd cuppa mashing, will go look to see what biscuits are in the cupboard - had toast and marmite for brekkie....
Will check back later, ta-ta for now abbers!

**Turnagain** · January 10, 2013, 02:00 PM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Greetings FABburritos....

Can you tell that our cold, dark days have me taking mind trips to Mexico to warm up? Aiy-yi-yi. I hope to have a bit of time to catch up with the latest here....

TT - you have got one solid 'tude about dealing with your liver situation. We'll keep showering you with PPPPPPPPPPPPs for positive power as your body heals....on top of the PPPPPPs you're giving yourself....I think you'll be shinier and healthier than ever soon.

Mick - how are your bruised buns doing, hun? I'm glad it wasn't worse! Your tumble sure didn't jar your wonderful sense of humor (humOUR) there. for you Brits and their wandering spawn.

Kuya - did I say I am so glad you are back....I sure missed you while you were off. You always have something interesting and intriguing to post....you....you....bed farter!

And Lilly...I saw you are back...I hope once work settles down that you'll be back here on a regular basis. Your wit and insights just makes me feel warm and happy.

TDN - great news on the driving front. More to go, but you're getting there with grace and grit.

Scottish Lass - it's really neat to see you change before our eyes. You are truly getting the groove of living La Vida AF.

Cantoo....where will you be adventuring next? I love reading about your treks and seeing your photos.

Det, buddy....are you on the road? I need a whiff of garlic. I hope we can chat this weekend?

Sun, like you and so many others here, I had problems with anxiety before and during my drinking addiction.

Alcohol really messes up the whole biochemical balance in the brain and gut where a lot of the enzyme processes take place. Restoring that balance - or in the case of quite a few of us - finding the balance in the first place - is a process that takes time and tweaking.

I was taking GABA powder daily until recently when my doctor cautioned me about the boomerang effect. It seems that an EXCESS of GABA can actually increase or even produce anxiety rather than reduce it. So now, I supplement with L-theanine which is a precursor to GABA. This helps the body produce GABA on its own. There is a current thread over in the holistic section about theanine with a lot of good info.

https://www.mywayout.org/community/f6...ety-71719.html

Beyond keeping the alcohol out of my life, eating right and exercise...perhaps the most powerful thing I do to eliminate the anxiety and harmful reactions to stress - is to cultivate gratitude. I used to dismiss this as pop-psy babble, but there is a massive physiological chain reaction that takes place throughout our entire system when we CHOOSE to focus on the good and positive aspects of a situation.

I am grateful to Lav and Byrdlady who really drove this key concept home in my mind early on in my quit. Gratitude cultivation takes daily attention on my part, yet as time goes by, I find that my default reaction to stresses in my life are now generally positive and constructive. The negative self-talk still tries to weasal in the cracks now and then. But it gets easier and easier to make it go away. It really wasn't that long ago when the only positive thing I could manage to think of was that I had another day of life ahead and another chance to change. Now, my gratitude list seems limitless. This is a change all of us can make instantly and the key to continued success....is to do it constantly.

Perhaps one of the most interesting changes in my thought process is that I am grateful that I had to deal with alcohol addiction. I not only survived it, but I am stronger and better because of it and the changes that took place because of this process. I am now longer weighed down with that gray, depressed feeling or riddled by incessant anxiety. I am present and have the emotional power to deal with everything life pitches at me.

Here are some links where you can learn more:

What Is the Connection Between GABA and Alcohol?

How good are GABA supplements for anxiety, stress and relaxation? | Extra Happiness

Foods To Increase Gaba | LIVESTRONG.COM

Off to conquer the flooring reno from hell! Someday I will know what it is like to live without a cloud of perpetual dust!

xoxoxox

**Kaslo** · January 10, 2013, 02:40 PM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Mick, you've outdone yourself today. Laffed my a$$ off, thanks! k

**Catbuddy** · January 10, 2013, 02:49 PM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Hi all,

Wonderful chatting here today. I'm back into my work full swing, and it's been hard to post.

SL, it IS getting cold here; I'm such a wimp. I want to stay inside bundled up. But it is past time for me to get exercise back into my schedule - it has been there, but erratic.

TT, I hope you have no pain or other symptoms. I have used Milk Thistle myself when taking Accutane (very hard on the liver); I really think it works.

SF, I have anxiety and panic, too. I love this idea that cultivating gratitude and positive thinking can reprogram my responses. That will be on my AF road at some point; I'm working on some other resolutions now, too. All to the good. I can also see a day where I will be grateful I faced this dependence and survived. It does make us strong, whole, mature, self-aware, all positive growth if we really deal with it rather than just survive it.

I have had some wonderful events of late. First, my sister, who has been through sobriety and relapse, asked me for the full details on our program. I sent them along, then got two phone calls yesterday - she's on Day 6. Heavens opened. I told her she could find me here as "Catbuddy." She was touched, and immediately said, "I named you that." I said, "I know; I've been hoping to be your light here, so I wanted you to be able to find me." So, we may be welcoming her, she may just read, but the L-Glut, Kudzu and vitamins have been purchased!

Then today, my close friend here, who knows my history of the past two years and is a daily wine and gin drinker, told me she is on Day 10. She wants to get 30 days AF (silent about after that). I said, I can recommend supplements that will make it easier. She was very excited. I shared with her a month ago that I quit, and she just kept saying how proud she is of me. Well, we are little lights when we silently burn.

I'm in triple digits now. I'll be thinking in months instead of days, then in years....then it will be like Lav and others, I just won't want it anymore.

I've been trying to think about cute little boy stories. May post one later.

Cat

**Kaslo** · January 10, 2013, 03:42 PM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Well done, Cat. You CAN do it. It takes courage and committment and patience and all the help you can get. Its great you have a few people you can talk to about it in real life, and I wish I had been able to help my sister, all those years ago.
All the best, Kas

**Lavande** · January 10, 2013, 06:19 PM

af day Thurs 10 Jan

Hey Turn, nice to see you

See, I wasn't kidding about the gratitude thing. It really does make everything easier

Cat, how wonderful about your sister & friend! We will have to fashion you a pair of angel wings, good job

Hello Kas, we seem to follow one another around these threads!

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