Attention: Old Timers

[Beaches]

Attention: Old Timers

Lots of great input and insight here and Breez you said it perfectly. This is a wonderful site and we all just need to keep supporting people with either abstaining or moderating.
Thank you all.

[diamond]

Attention: Old Timers

Breez I agree with you, I am new but I can see both sides of this now, I couldn't earlier.

I think maybe some of us were enabling but not realising it, I'm sure it wasn't done on purpose.
Thanks everyone for your points of view.

[bootcampbarbie]

Attention: Old Timers

it isn't just about rachel. it is about the thousands of people that lurk on this site and never post. there are no rules for this site. none. we are here all of us for each other. we have an honest desire to stop or cut down or whatever, or don't know, maybe we think something is wrong, we need help but don't know yet. the point is to just be here for each other because for once in our lives, someone gets the pain and shame we go through.
and to condemn or shame people is not the place in this forum. not the place. in fact, shame, condemnation and all else that goes with that is what has most people search for that lonely path and that bottle to begin with. it is what we put up with everyday that separates us from ourselves and from each other. so, this is an open forum. not a one of us ones it. no cliches although there are just going to be that is life. but there could be thousands on this site really posting all day for the good that it provides. so why aren't there?

threads are open. if you don't like a thread, don't read it, don't post on it and move on. if you don't like drunkalogues as you put it. don't read it, don't post on it and move on. it is an odd thing to me having spent at least a good 9 years sober and well then back out again trying my hand at moderatiion. it is an odd thing for me that someone would say having a thread that purges ones most embarrasing moment, a place you could actually go to say it, not be judged, hopefully laugh at your shame and be able to move on. that somehow that would be judged as making you want to go back and drink? not getting it. the only way one releases is to be able to share it, and never have the burden to bare it, drunk posting or not, and have a witness who gets it. one who puts no energy on it. that says come on, let it go. release it. look who you are now? you don't have to carry that guilt anymore. we get it.

here is the danger i ran into having been "an old timer" with all those hefty years tucked under my little tiny barbie belt. i got really forgot for me how important it was to remember that each and everyday is the value. and for me now coming back and having a few days under my belt listening and supporting each and every no matter if they are drunk or have an hour under their belt is for me the duty i have to myself and them of knowing that at least someone is there who gets it. someone, and i don't judge you, i know exactly what you are going through. isn't a trainwreck i haven't been on. there is something to be said for long term sobriety as i've had it and have friends that have it. there is always something for me to be a witness to and a reminder to be around any brother or sister who needs a helping hand and to anyone that when i need it will gladly give one to me.
there is no place here for divide and separation. rules and regulations. shame or judgement of who can play. you are all invited each and every. as we always said in some programs i've participated in. some of us are sicker than others and there by the grace of god go i. everyone is welcome on this boat.

[trixietrack]

Attention: Old Timers

I think Skendall has started an interesting post. In many ways I agree with what she has written. The reason I joined MWO is to start having some control over this awful alcohol habit, and to meet other people who are battling with alcohol addiction and the problems they face while intoxicated.

I guess once in a while someone does slip and starts a drunk thread or replies while drunk.
I visit here quite a lot and haven't seen anything that is seriusly offensive or malicious.
I hope that we can all continue to support each other and to offer helpful advice.
This is a wonderful site. I enjoy the fact that we can express ourselves without feeling judged or feeling guilt.

big hug to all

trix

[nattie]

Attention: Old Timers

I don't post much but I read LOADS. This has really touched me. I feel for Rachel as I have been there - MWO is such a massive support & information that at times you can feel it is justified to drink. There is a very thin line between comparision & critisism............we've all been here so we can relate, but by answering someones threads doesn't mean we condone. I cannot think that anyone here would encourage someone to drink & carry on a life they weren't happy with.
I would like to think we are all here because our drinking is out of control.....whether we calm it down or stop we're all after the same thing.

much love
x

[nattie]

Attention: Old Timers

I don't post much but I read LOADS. This has really touched me. I feel for Rachel as I have been there - MWO is such a massive support & information that at times you can feel it is justified to drink. There is a very thin line between comparision & critisism............we've all been here so we can relate, but by answering someones threads doesn't mean we condone. I cannot think that anyone here would encourage someone to drink & carry on a life they weren't happy with.
I would like to think we are all here because our drinking is out of control.....whether we calm it down or stop we're all after the same thing.

much love
x

[Saint Jude]

Attention: Old Timers

I just lost a post...Grrrr Oh well...

Amen to Bootcamp!:thanks:
I think a lot of these posts take on a life of their own... some of them are real serious. Some end up just plain goofy.
If we needed strict guidlines & rules for posting... I'm pretty sure RJ wouldv'e cosidered that already...How about we give a bit of credit where it's due?
Thanks again for everyone for especially RJ ...for making this happen!:h

This is an awsesome place! Lets not belittle it with pettiness.

Hugs,
:new:
Judie

PS, I know I was "hurtin' for certain" when I first found this place... pretty sad state... Believe me, sometimes just a friendly hello, or a curt reply can make or break ya!

[rachel28]

Attention: Old Timers

just a quick thanks,especially to barbie, an to say i am listening an reading, an still hopefull lots a love xx

[YoungAtHeart]

Attention: Old Timers

This is a very hard one. I know that in the past, I have been seen as enabling when I was trying to provide support and didn't want to seem confrontational. I think that the line between support and enabling can be pretty blurry sometimes, and different people definitely evaluate it in different ways. I know that I respond better to support than "tough love", unless I know someone very, very well. Others respond to tough love and take what seems like excessive reassurance as tacit permission to keep on drinking.

Only Rachel is in charge of what she will ultimately do. Meanwhile, SKendall is entitled to her feelings and expressing them. Rachel doesn't need to apologize, she is just reaching out.

Rachel, I hope that everything has gone well for you today. I am very concerned for you, and I hope that you find the support and the structure to beat this.

Just my two cents.

Kathy

[bootcampbarbie]

Attention: Old Timers

again, rachel as i don't know why. i'm sorry i'm laughing. cuz this isn't funny. but darling trust me i've read lots of posts and while yes i've told you you are the poster that is pissed the moster. you are definitely not the only person i've read posts on this happy channel that has been tipsied while posting. so, i'd like to broaden the spectrum and say. people post on this site in many frames of mind and sometimes they are under the influence of various substances and it is slightly to very obvious. and there are still no rules at the end of the day for this site unless rj wants to make them. so instead of barriers to entry. i for one am happy for the open arms policy. perhaps there may come a day when i'm down and out one nite and a bit in my cups and need a place to go. and the doors will not be shut to me. i'm actually having this picture of a breathilizer hooked up to my computer and if i don't pass it i can't get into the site. see i'm sorry. this isn't funny. but you have to admit that image is funny. So, thank you skendall for the brave posting. and i also responded to you and chrysa on the other posting about the embarrasing stories. i really appreciate that we can all have our ways of viewing the world. makes it all special. i'm going out now to buy my breathalizer for my computer. oh my gawd. that seriously is funny. okay it isn't but it really is. be good to yourselves tonight.

[sujul]

Attention: Old Timers

Lots of good stuff on this thread...I actually posted most of what follows on another thread, but I think it actually applies here more than it did there, so I'm posting it again (apologies for those who read it in GD!):

.....The wonder of this site is that for all our many, many differences we all share this desire to change our destructive relationship with alcohol....that said, it's worth repeating that we really ARE very different--different outlooks, cultures, beliefs, ages, options, life circumstances, etc....so what works for one person will not necessarily work for someone else--that's why this is called MWO-->MY way out!

...In some ways, I see this site as an experiment in human relationships--this whole cyber-network thing is so relatively new and we almost don't know how it works yet...I mean, really, what IS our relationship to each other? What does it mean to care about people we have no actual contact with? I am not saying it isn't meaningful, I'm just posing questions that I think require some thought...honestly, I am fascinated by the way we all relate to each other here--and, more often than not, I am truly moved by other people's stories and struggles....

I am glad to be a part of this...and, even though I have been AF for a length of time, I am more than willing to read drunken posts and try to offer a cyber hug or a word of encouragement....the only real requirement I think (and a hat-toss to AA), the only requirement should be a desire to change our lives in relation to alcohol.... How this is accomplished will continue to be a very personal and individual thing....

We can cheer each other on, offer advice, suggestions, share our own path but, ultimately, each of us has to make our own decisions about our lives....and sometimes the decisions others make will break our hearts and sometimes those decisions will make us gasp with admiration--just like in "real" life...

But mostly, we're all here just struggling along...and I applaud everyone who has the courage to post--wherever they may be on the journey!

:h

[SKendall]

Attention: Old Timers

Hello again. I've had a day of being pelted and many, many supportive pm's. Thank you to all.

I have genuine concern for Rachel and have pm'd her in the past in the most supportive way. Almost 500 posts in less than 2 months under the influence. was pushing the envelope in my opinion. I only wish the best for Rachel, but I believe her problem needs professional help and that her supporters in a loving way were enabling her. Some of our more regular members (much better term than old timers) have expressed their concern too, mostly privately. Rachel needs professional help to detox and this site cannot provide that.

The success stories on this site are due to RJ's MWO program and this site has enormous integrity because of the members who post their success and their failures. I've had dreadful times myself and know that the intent to stop drinking is a difficult path. With the tools of this site, I am healthier, as well as many others, let's not forget the success stories.

This site also can evoke drama and we have had many experiences with that in the past which is why I didn't defend my position earlier.

I thank every member of this site for the support you have shown me and especially to RJ who developed this program so we could all have a vision of sobriety.

My best wishes to Rachel in her recovery.:h

[YoungAtHeart]

Attention: Old Timers

Very well said, SKendall. I'm glad that you posted this.

Hugs,:l
Kathy

[SKendall]

Attention: Old Timers

Thanks to you Kathy. A lot of the members who have supported my privately don't want to do it publicly, so I am definitely not alone.

Love you all

[rachel28]

Attention: Old Timers

id like to say thanks for posting on the matter, an just to say, i am trying, xx