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**Waves 2** · November 12, 2006, 02:49 AM

Sunday, November 12th

Hi Tumadre, sorry we were posting at the same time. I've wanted to change for years but when my daughter was expecting her first child I wanted to be available to drive her to the hospital if the need arose. Now, I want it for myself as well as for any possible emergency trips.

Hi all,
It is early morning here in uk. Usually early morning wake up is due to MY drinking early night before. But today, hubby's drinking night before has woken me. He fell asleep downstairs and came up at 6am so now I'm awake and unable to get back. Of course, by 9 o clock tonight I will be shattered.

Glad the gym went better than expected Becca. Get some tips from Jen on posting men on here.

Rachele, sorry about hubby. Hope a new opportunity is around the corner.

Allie, SM, Gypsi, Mkr, Jude, hope the health issues are progressing as well as they can.

Everyone, love to you all as always.

Waves x
__________________

**tumadre** · November 12, 2006, 03:02 AM

Sunday, November 12th

Hey, Waves-
Funny how many times the reasons are kids! I just know how many times I rearranged schedules, made the kids stay over at their dad's house or made him go pick them up, or whatever...just so I could plan on drinking late into the night. It was great when my oldest got her driver's license. Then I could ask her to not only pick up her sister from where ever she was, but then she could come get me from where ever I was :H God bless designated driver's! (Not really funny, I know) It was very gracious of you to yield to my Sunday post. Hope the day is not too unbearably long for you. Can you fit in a nap? Did you notice that we've both had the "small stones" sayings as a signature?

**tumadre** · November 12, 2006, 03:06 AM

Sunday, November 12th

Becca-
It's been days, and you probably don't remember, but your kind suggestion to find a quiet place for myself for a few days made me really stop and think about what I wanted to do with my marriage. I'm used to "shutting up and running away", and I decided that this time, I didn't want to. It may sound funny, but it's almost like you gave me permission to run away, and I got to decide to stay and speak up...
So thank you.
tumadre

**Allie** · November 12, 2006, 07:43 AM

Sunday, November 12th

Good Morning~
Good question Tumadre. Unfortunately it wasnt a "little" quiet voice telling me to do something about the drinking, it was a really loud one that scared the heck out of me!! My husbands! I've shared the story before, but basically I came here as the result of making a fool out of myself in front of my family and it really hurt them. Especially my daughter, and so I had to humbly go to her the next day and ask her forgiveness. She never said a word, just tears. It broke my heart and I hated myself for what I had done. My husband was furious and told me either I find an acceptable way to get help for myself, or HE was going to get help for me. Well that scared me.... so I got online and started searching. That was in January, and although I still struggle, I dont struggle NEARLY to the extent that I did before, and I have never made a fool of myself like that again. I feel like it is under control. I still drink more than I want to at times, particuarly when stressed/depressed, but even as I say that, I feel I am gaining more control by the day in my times of stress.

Well I am up way early for a weekend, but just had restless sleep all night. Two glasses of wine last night very early in the evening, and to sleep early, so that's why I guess. Either that or the fact that the dog and cat decided to play Nascar racing up and down the stairs starting at 4 a.m. Arrrggggh.....

Wishing everyone a fabulous day!
Allie

**dilayne** · November 12, 2006, 08:04 AM

Sunday, November 12th

Good Morning Tamdre,
Great post! I guess I have to confess that when I hear the question, 'what made me want to change', I personally can't answer it specifically relating to the drinking because my desire to change has been to change everything and that the behavior of drinking is just one small piece of that..for me it was a symptom of something deeper in me that needed to grow, heal..and change how I am relating to my 'self', to people and to life in general. But, I will say that the desire to quit drinking in 1986 was for the kids more than anything...I stayed sober until about 4 years ago when I started dabbling again with the drinking..this was the beginning of a huge transitional phase in my life..I believe full heartedly that my drinking was more a response to the need to change/grow then the other way around..I drank to resist the changes that needed to occur..because in order to make the changes necessary to go on to the next level 'of consciousness'..I was going to have to feel and heal..and every cell in my body resisted that, and drinking was a way to numb out that battle within..SO, I moderated the best I could for the past few years, but would binge..I actually deliberately chose to allow myself to drink instead of telling myself that I had to quit...because I accepted that I was doing it for a reason and that I was going to find out what it was...I've done that with a year of psychotherapy..all along being honest with myself about my drinking..I think the process helped me to address some important things at a core level which in turned helped me to let go of the drinking behavior when I did..the need to numb myself and to resist the growth and change that life was calling me to make began to subside, so finally, with the help of MWO and the topamax specifically, I was succesful in moderating and then quitting...I chose to quit because it could not be denied that I drink for a very specifica purpose (I'm not a socialite, it's not a social habit..I drink to medicate myself..yes, I love the taste of wine, but that is not why I've ever drank) I had to make an honest decision about my drinking and finally ask myself if I wanted to continue to medicate myself...or to honor my desire to feel my feelings, to be in touch with the depths of my LIFE..I knew that I couldn't do both..the battle between these two 'opposites' is what caused me so much pain..the hangovers only reminded me of this to well. I realize that everyone drinks for different reasons and don't have the same relationship with alcohol as I do..it's such a personal thing. I really wish I could have my wine...I actually do love the romantic side of it, the nice lull of the buzz, I love holding a wine glass and I love that it makes me uninhibited..I miss being able to have that, but it's the battle that had to go on inside of me in order to enjoy those things..it just wasn't worth it anymore, it was such an inner contradiction to a deeper urge, a deeper desire..I had to feed one of them, or to be tormented..I mean, I had to either feed the urge to drink, or the urge to reach the depths of my soul..my existance..I couldn't do both and have any kind of peace..that is what made me 'change'...as for the specifics..well, let's just say a few trips to hell and back were motivators as well!

**Waves 2** · November 12, 2006, 08:11 AM

Sunday, November 12th

Tumadre, I couldn't remember who I copied the saying from I just knew it was so apt for me. I'm sorry if I "stole it "from you !!!!

I managed to go back to sleep for an hour so I feel better now. :l

**Mighty Mouse II** · November 12, 2006, 09:05 AM

Sunday, November 12th

Hi everybody! Tumadre, what a great question! For me it was unequivocably the fact that I am a control freek. I cannot stand not having control of everything around me. I had quit several times for long periods of time. But that drove me nuts as well for a reason unique to me (and probably applies to NO one else). In my twisted mind, I felt that if I just gave it up, it was like failing. It had beaten me, I couldn't control it. Besides, I really enjoy drinking a glass of wine, and in moderation, it has significant health benefits. So, everytime I'd quit I would decide to start drinking "just a couple a day". First thing you know, I was drinking a lot. My husband suggested waiting until he got home. I tried that a week before I joined. It was the worst and prompted me to join. I didn't drink less, I drank it in a shorter period of time. I don't usually show signs of being drunk or have side effects in the morning. But that week, I was over the top.

So, I decided I needed some help. Problem is in my position, I have to be very careful how "public" my participation can be in a recovery program. So, I decided I would go onto the internet to try to find the 12 steps and see if I could apply them to my needs. You know, it is amazing. Everybody talks about the 12 steps, but nobody says what they are!!! Meanwhile, I stumbled onto this forum. I liked the way you could structure a modification program because that addresses my deep-seeded need to continue to drink moderately. I also was impressed with its flexibility, so that different people could do different things, and further, that no one on the Board sits in judgment of anybody else. Finally, I'm a "health nut". I loved the fact nuitrition, exercise, and relaxation therapy was a key part of the program (though I have not quite gotten to the relaxation part).

Well, the program was a dream come true for me. It is really working! And I have come to look at everyone here as a friend. We all have so much in common! Its amazing! In fact, since the program is working so well for me and I'm not having any more problems, I am wondering if I will be required to leave the Board at some point -- I would hate that! I really enjoy it here.

Tumadre, I am sorry to hear about your husband's and your daughter's difficulty. Have you contacted the American Consulate here -- sometimes it can be easier to have a US-based Official contact the American Embassy in the foreign country -- it has a tendency to get things moving faster.

Wish you luck,

MM

**fsophiah** · November 12, 2006, 10:50 AM

Sunday, November 12th

What brought me here? I had been trying to figure out what I was going to do about my drinking for a long time. For two years, at least, I would say--New Year's Day, no more drinking, and then twilight came and with it the complacency of the chardonnay. Lent! I teach at an Episcopal School, lots of talk about the church calendar. 40 days! Perfect! Didn't happen. Since chapel is compulsory at my school, I decided to pray. God, grant me the courage to change. This went on every day for a year. I lot of what stopped me was the feeling that I was going to have to go to AA because other people in my family had, and I just didn't want to give my whole life to them. I was grading AP exams in Daytona FL, and on the last day, after hating myself all week because I knew how much more I drank than the other people, much like me, whom I respected deeply, I walked out of the hotel, looked at the beach, the pelicans, the pristine perfection of the morning, and I knew that I was going to find something. I knew that I would make a phone call or I would do a google, and something I had yet to discover would answer back. So, I came home, drank chardonny all evening the night of my return, looked at my irascible husband's face and knew he must be disgusted by me, and the next day I googled....something, I can't remember what. By noon, I had downloaded and read the book, ordered the supps and CDs, and read all the posts. As it turned out, I was out of cholesterol medication, and I was forced to go to the dr. I couldn't avoid it. Even in that I seemed to feel a push from outside myself. So, I printed the book and the Lancet article, and I told him I needed topamax, and he just sat down and wrote me the prescription. I was in business, and I never looked back. I called last summer my 40 days in the wilderness. At the end of the summer we went to Asia to visit my son, and very close to the end of the trip, we visited the Buddhist monastery on the island of Lantau at Hong Kong. There is a huge buddha statue at the top of the mountain, and we climbed up all the steps. Looking out on landscape, I said, "We won't see this day again." Now. Somehow that says it was meant to be. I'm a lifer. As I write this, I know the religious imagery might be a turn-off to some. I can't explain it. It just happened that way. I don't like theology or dogma, but it started with a prayer, and there I landed, at the top of a mountain, at the foot of a 50-ft.-high statue of Buddha.

**mary8305** · November 12, 2006, 11:35 AM

Sunday, November 12th

This is a great topic and reading everyone's has giving me some pull back to what I need to do.Lately I have fallen off the moderation wagon so to speak and I've been drinking more and I need to be honest because I've been taking my topa later in the evening it doesn't stop the craving as much that way and a few times skipping the evening dose so I won't get the really bad headache the next day and I'm wondering why I'm sabotaging something that is working so well and reading Dilayne's thread has helped me realize the feelings I don't want to feel the pain I want to escape, sometimes I want to be numb and the usual moderate 1 or 2 doesn't do that. But I have to realize the tradeoffs, I don't hate myself for being drunk all the time or having my children and husband worry about me.It's funny how quickly you forget where you were or how much pain you were in and that was in August that's why I started this program which has been really great,so I need to get back on it and want it again remember why I came,thanks all for helping me do that,Mary

**Mighty Mouse II** · November 12, 2006, 11:38 AM

Sunday, November 12th

Fsophiah, I don't think anyone here would be offended by your religious beliefs and expressions. I think it is great! I have come to believe that this is a place where you can share your inner most thoughts if it will help you or others in any way. I have been impressed by the tolerance level by everyone on several fronts.

Like you, I too rely on G-d to help me through -- not only in this but all aspects of my life. I am always (silently) amazed at how people can face life without it. I, of course, respect their choice. I am a Christian Jew, and I actually attend an Episcopol Church for the Christian side of my faith.

One particular aspect of our Synogogue service that has been extremely helpful in this area and others is the "L'chah Dodi" - "the end of deed is first in thought". The song tells how intelligent people function by deciding upon a goal and then work their way toward its fulfillment through carefully planned daily action. The more accomplished the person, the more ambitious the goal, and the more difficult and complex the road to its attainment. This is a classic weekly song at Shabbot services.

This philosophy has certainly been an inbred thought for me and an important aspect of how my program here is working, as well as in other areas of my life. In this case, I wanted to reach a goal in my drinking habits. Each evening I would plan on what I would do the following day that would bring me further towards my goal (very important to do it before going to bed because they way we feel when first getting up can cloud good judgment). I give it great thought, trying to envision what I would look like doing it, how I would feel, etc. At the end of each day, I evaluate the progress and plan the next days goals (I admit I would pray through the process). With few exceptions it has allowed me to meet my goals everyday. I get stronger with each week, continue to challenge myself, and I am even reaching out using this process in other similar areas of my life (like getting rid of 12-24 diet cokes a day!)

This process doesn't work for everyone. Some people on this forum like to go several days AF and then let lose and enjoy. I wish I could do that, but it does not work for me. I have to follow a pattern every single day, without exception, in order to modify my behavior. If I tried this technique that is working so well for others, I would not want to go back to AF days. I would fail (I haved tried to do it that way before). But I do so admire the people who can do that. That is what makes this forum so special. Everyone is so similar, and yet, so different. It is by sharing our ideas of what's working, what's not, our thoughts and actions -- in this way, we can all help each other to overcome this monster on our backs. This is truly a special place.

This is my long-winded way of thanking you for sharing your religious revelation. It is inspiring to me.

Thank you,

MM

**Mighty Mouse II** · November 12, 2006, 11:50 AM

Sunday, November 12th

Mary, it sounds like you are well on your way!!! Recognizing the "trigger" that makes us want to drink is so important. I found mine also through this forum, and it was a pivotal point in my recovery. Mine is stress. I have alot of it!!! I was running to wine because it was my form of making myself relax. Once I started I didn't want to stop because in my mind I would have to stop relaxing. A couple of things that I am doing that really helps me (maybe they might help others here):

I now have a relaxing bath in the morning before starting my day (I had to really plan this out, as my day usually starts in a whirlwind). I use candle light and aromotherapy bath stuff, music, etc. Iit has made a huge difference as I start the day out fresh instead of feeling like the new weight of this day is pouring on top of the day before. My one rule is no alcohol in the room -- so I'm sipping herbal teas.

I do the same thing at night before I go to bed, but I add messsaging creams and stuff. It relaxes me and I sleep all night.

I walk just before cocktail hour, listening to music. FINDING MUSIC THAT EXPRESSES HOW I FEEL HAS BEEN A BIG FACTOR FOR ME.

So, these are just the things that are working for me. But I'm always looking for new ideas. As you find what works for you, please do share. I hope everyone will!!

With kindest regards,

MM

**Saint Jude** · November 12, 2006, 02:03 PM

Sunday, November 12th

Mornin' Everyone!

Great question. Lets see, How did I end up hear anyway?

Kinda like Allie, back in January, I was at a place where I had been waaayyy too many times before... I remember my Husband looking at me and telling me he would always love me, but he couldn't live this way.
It wasn't the first time I'd heard him say that... but I knew it WAS the LAST.

I was also just so desperately sick of myself. I was disgusted with the person I had become. I woke up in the morning hating myself, dreading the light of day, dreading the fact that I would try and not drink again, and knowing I would weaken by the end of the day, and go get something, just to get me thru. I couldn't sleep at night, because I worried about everything. It was a horrible waking nightmare, that I had created, from a wonderful creative life, that I knew I used to have.

The self loathing was the worst. But I was just in this cycle I coudn't seem to pull myself out of.

I even went out & started my truck one day with the garage doors closed... but it stunk too bad, and I couldn't do that to my Husband.(he doesn't know that)
I thought about going & jumping in the ocean off of a cliff, just anything to stop this self imposed jail. But I couldn't do it.

I prayed a lot.... And finally one morning I stumbled across this site. I think it was the answer to my prayer. I went to my DR. and got a p-script for topa. So here by the grace of God...:h

Whoops ... I think I just wrote a book!
wasn't planning on that...

:l Judie

**tinkerbell** · November 12, 2006, 03:28 PM

Sunday, November 12th

what brought me here? The realisation that I am becoming my mother. That I have started lying to people about how much I am drinking. That my drinking takes precedence over treating my depression and is probably the cause of a lot of it anyway. Losing my job and my self confidence and all motivation.

I have been bad this weekend, I drank far too much on Friday but strangely wasn't hungover! I was drinking solidly for 8 hours. I only had two glasses of wine yesterday, I really wanted more as I was arguing wigth my girlfriend, but I knew me taking another glass would just add fuel to the fire.

No alcohol today as I have another job interview tomorrow, hopefully they will finally be able to tell me if I have the position or not. I had no idea the whole process would take this long, its been a month!

I don't even know if I can hold down a job, but I need to give it one more try. If I find I can't then I will have to get signed off on incapacity benefit. Something I have tried to avoid as I am concerned about a permanent break in my working record. However my gf has made me see that my health is more important than my career. I'm lucky to have her. I must not mess this up.

**fsophiah** · November 12, 2006, 04:42 PM

Sunday, November 12th

I spent an hour on the phone with my son in Japan over skype (an amazing invention, by the way). One of the reasons he is disappointed about not being able to come home with his girlfriend (whom he won't leave) is that he can't get a Rx for topamax. Is there any way anyone can think of that he can get medication in Japan? I have extra, and I could send it to him, but I'm afraid it's too risky to send it through the mail. Any advice? He is making progress, and he's been sober for about 2 months now. I want to help him.

Judy, what a sad story! I hate to think of you in that garage. No wonder you are such a loyal and stalward member of our crew. I guess we all have something to be grateful for. I hope you can find that too, tinkerbell. Keep at it. Becoming a mother changes everything, doesn't it?

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