Monday 11th December

[Waves 2]

Hi all,

I have just been inspecting my tracker ( again ). It doesn't look fantastic.
Since the 30 days abs ( 16 days ago) I should have had 8 days AF to stick to my plan but only have 5. Also I'm not supposed to go above 3 drinks per drinking day and have broken that rule too on three occasions.

However, looking on the positive side I have not drunk to ?? level ( which I take to mean where you can't remember anything or blackout) since 7th October. This is still good right?

But, are the stones that I have moved ( see caption at bottom of post) piled up too high and in danger of slipping back to where they were? Or is the mountain still moving to where I want it to be?

I have woken up early morning with low self-esteem and worrying about everything again this morning which is not a good sign.

When I think of all the problems that other people on here are having to deal with this seems so petty but we have all have to focus on how we, as individuals, move forwards as well as to give group support to those who are suffering such huge difficulties. Gypsi, my heart goes out to you.

Love to you all as always, :l

Waves

[eustacia]

Monday 11th December

:l Dear Waves,

Do you think that it could be that you're yet to hit your stride? Thirty days AF is a big accomplishment and kudos to you for managing it! Moderation (at least for me) is a completely different thing. It is like trying to negotiate a slippery slope without the clear sign post of abstention to guide one. I know that this month I was planning on drinking less than I have to prepare for a nerve wracking visit with both sides of my family in a couple of weeks. Yesterday, I had about 3 1/2 glasses of wine and that was more than I had planned. I didn't get into any immediate trouble because of it but it has shaken my self-confidence big time that I can virtually refrain from drinking while around my family. Like you, I had set a specific AF goal for this month and, so far, it doesn't look like I'm meeting it. I feel that I should be working much harder to loosen the grasp of my psychological vulnerability to drinking before I leave for the week long visit. But I keep sliding down the mountain . . .

You know what? We both have one choice only, and it is the same choice. We have to keep on going. To look at the flip side of your homily via a metaphor, I feel like Sisyphus rolling a stone up a mountain, again and again. And that stone is getting friggin' heavy!

You are right that Gypsi, sweet soul, is suffering epic difficulties. I'm sure that one of the reasons that she feels our love and support is because she knows that we, too, have had and will have dark moments. But we're going to make it and so is beloved Gypsi.

Hang in there, toots. :h

Love, Eustacia

[fsophiah]

Monday 11th December

It sounds as though the two of your are having the same difficulties I am having. I am back to drinking every day. I don't think I drink more than 8 oz. of wine at any time, but I can tell that I am looking for the buzz again. I have renewed my Rx for topa. I thought I'd take it over the holidays, even though I have problems with the side effects. Then, I am going to go back to 30 days AF. And the thing about waking up is one that brought me here in the first place. Less than a year ago, I regularly woke up at 4 a.m., and I spent an hour hating myself. Lately, I've been waking up, not hating myself really, but worrying about backsliding. We're here, though, aren't we? If I can say this to someone, then I have forced myself "out." It may be too much to expect to have the expansive optimism that I had when I started this program. I'm going to have to be a yeoman for a while before I can be a master.

[Mighty Mouse II]

Monday 11th December

Hi Everybody! Dear Waves and Eustacia, I think you both are doing great! Don't be so hard on yourself, remember moderation, unlike abstinence is a process. Most people who decide to do abstinence, wake up one morning and just decide they've had enough, so they concentration on removing the temptation from their lives. Moderation is different. Moderation is setting up goals that GRADUALLY change your habits for long-term growth with the goal of maintaining control. So, it is harder because you have to constantly evaluate where you are, where you want to be, and set DAILY goals to meet it. If you don't meet the daily goals, then re-evaluate -- was it a good goal, maybe too unrealistic, was it a good, but something hit you broadside that caused you not to reach that goal, so you have to plan what you will do if something similar happens again? If you met the goal, what was it that helped you do so, so that you can use it to help you in the future. These are all continual questions moderators must evaluate on a daily basis. But most important, look at where you were when you started and look at where you are now. If you are moving up and down on an upward trend than you are doing fantastic. If not, you need to re-evaluate your goals, maybe they are too hard at this time, which can cause a downward spiral as it becomes frustrating not being able to reach them.

From the outside, you both look like you are doing great, Eustacia you have all this other stuff going on that would drive a Saint crazy, yet you have done extremely well on your drinking.

Waves, as long as you are maintaining control and evaluating, like you are right now, you will do continue to do great!!!

I think you are both awesome!!! If you are feeling a little low, I recommend you take a long, brisk walk and think about your goals for the coming week. Make sure they are realistic. Another thing that cheers me up when I'm feeling insecure is to think about where I was when I started this program and where I am now. That really makes me feel good.

Like all of you, I am no expert in this area, but moderation is working well for me. So please don't take my advice as trying to tell you what to do, but rather, just someone who is working through what you are as well, and just sharing what is working for me.

I THINK YOU ARE BOTH FABULOUS AND REAL ROLE MODELS FOR THE REST OF US.

Love you both,
MM

[soccermom]

Monday 11th December

I'm going to tell you what:
There are some very eloquent ladies on this sight! You can put your thoughts into words so nicely...I am not quite able to do that, but yet when I read your words I think, "that's what I wanted to say!"
I, too, have felt the ladder beneath slipping. I have been debating upping my topa level, but than think that I just need to up my level of expectations for myself. On the abs board, (I think it was yesterday) MikeupNorth describes nicely his experiences of what it was like to wake up hungover and waste his days as opposed to now and having the ability to function so nicely without alcohol. It really has stuck with me. Not that permanant abs has ever been a goal for me, hence why I'm on the mods board...but perhaps something I'm missing is a stretch of abs...something I've not considered...something maybe I should.
Love you dearly ladies.
sm-mary

[Mighty Mouse II]

Monday 11th December

Soccermom, I think you express yourself great!!! And I also think that you need to do what is best for you. Its good that you are keeping an open mind. One thing that really helps me to stay on track is that at the end of each day before going to bed, I evaluate how I did and I plan what I'm going to do tomorrow. I'm now in a routine so I don't have to do that much anymore. But if I have a day where I slip, then the next morning I really go into the evaluative process to figure out how I let it happen, set the goal for the day to get back on track. I don't take any medication so I don't know how changing that would effect your success, but I think there are many people here who could probably advise you on the Topa -- but I think its great that we are all reflecting on where we want to be so we can plan for a great New Year!!!

Love,
MM

[Hawk]

Monday 11th December

Monday morning all ?

E, Waves, Sophia, SM ? What are you guys doing in my head. This is exactly what I am experiencing as well. Thank you for bringing it up! I too have looked at my drink tracker and have consumed something every day but 2 in December. Not my goal and yet, I have not had any day where I was out of my mind or incapacitated the next day (Thank God). But it could easily happen if I do not watch. I don?t know if it is just because the holidays are approaching and I feel I have more liberty or what. Anyway, I am glad to know that I am not alone with this issue. I too have been waking up at 4 (what is the magic with that hour???) but not because of wine, I think its now just habit.

MM - Thanks for the advice on setting goals. Its something I need to work into a daily routine. I wish I had time for a long brisk walk but unfortunately right now, I don?t! Does the time on the elliptical torture device count? LOL! And you are right, when I look at where I was before I got here, I am better than that so for that I am grateful.

Mike ? Can I give you a list of shopping? Good luck with holiday preparations! Did your team win the tournament?

Gypsi ? My thoughts are with you. Please continue to take care of yourself.

Everyone yet to come ? have a super day!

[Lucy Van Pelt]

Monday 11th December

Good morning all!!

I do think it takes continual monitoring of ourselves to keep on track, especially this time of year, with all the holiday stuff around. Also, for those of us under unusual stress, like many of us on this site.
Gypsi- My heart goes out to you....you have so many arms around you here!!!
Hawk- You are in a scary time....but we are all looking forward to AFTER Dec. 2oth..and know all will be OK!!

Many others too...family stress, around the holiday's can make drinking harder...etc. For those moderating, it can be tougher, and I guess it IS important to set realistic goals, remember where you USED to be, and not be too hard on yourself, lest you set yourself up for that ..."screw it...I might as well just blow it" attitude.

Personally, I think I am better off with abs...It is just to exausting to try to agonize all the time about "how much...when....if..." and I am just not very good at it anyway. Not that I am great at the abs thing yet....far from it lol. But that is what my goal needs to be.

Anyway, I am planning a nice day. I am not working today, so I am going to take advantage of that and try to get a little more holiday shopping done. We celebrate Channukah, so I have to be done by Friday..yikes!!..I don't have much more to do. Just some fill in gifts for my kids...But those "fill in" gifts get hard when you have teens. Hard to find inexpensive "fill-ins"....like the equivalent to stocking stuffers. Their tastes have gotten a little to pricey at this age!!! OY!! LOL

Wishing you all a wonderful Monday.

Beth

[lushy]

Monday 11th December

Morning muffs!!!

Sm-Mary, funny you said that about what Mikeupnorth wrote about hangovers. I have been thinking about it constantly since I read it as I have had too many hangovers lately, and of course all because of my own doing, no one elses. He summed up very well what a complete waste of time and days it can be. I plan to have a 2-4 AF days this week, not only from the drinking standpoint but also because I can feel my muffin growing and it is making me uncomfortable.

Waves, I hope you can find a level of moderating you are comfortable with. Sometimes moderating does seem more challening with all of the plotting and planning and thinking about drinking versus just having an AF day. Don't be down on yourself. You have moved more stones than most of us here.

Hawk, did the decorations make it out of their boxes?

Fan, Glad you had a nice weekend. My daughter just started bball this year and she has a horrible coach who is teaching them nothing and they are playing against these schools who have excellent coaches. It was like watching the Three Stooges watching my daughter's team play this weekend. My husband and I were crying from laughing so hard. Fortunately they are too young to care. I do wish they had a better coach though as I used to love playing basketball. Someone here wanted to know what a sloppy joe was. Was that you Waves? Basically it is ground meat mixed with a tomato sauce with spices and you "slop" it all onto a hamburger bun. They are very messy, hence the name. I have not had one since I was a kid.

Jen, how did you shopping go? Are you done? We have missed you around here.

To everyone else, a big hug to you. Happy Monday to all.

P.S. Beth we were posting at the same time!!! Good luck finding gifts. My daughter is officially past the dollar store age where I could get so many great things. Now we are in expensive terrirtory. I know your pain.

[Preciouspinot]

Monday 11th December

Good morning to all! I am feeling a lot of the stressors as everyone else here and of course it stems from the holiday season. I feel some of the best tools that help me are:

1) Being very organized as to what I need to do...I look at that list and say to myself that I can't drink to excess and all of it done

2) Positive attitude! If I drink a little too much one night, I start the morning with All in One, water and make a new list for the day...I move on

3)A sense of humor! I try not to take myself too seriously or the self imposed stress...laughing feels a hell of a lot better than any buzz any day!

Love all you guys!!!! I'll check in later...

[dilayne]

Monday 11th December

Good Morning..these post are why i still hang around the moderation board...sorry, but this is where I'm filled up the most, even though I've chosen Abstinence...I hope you don't mind! I can't add anything else that hasn't been said already this morning except that moderation is definitely the harder thing to do...I wanted so much to be able to do it..and actually was very succesful if you looked at my drink count vs. a few days of going way overboard, it's the mental calestenics around the effort that I just wasn't willing to do anymore...I still wish I could have a few glasses of wine..lately, probably more than ever..i.e. the holiday 'season'..but twice in my life, I've faced this issue and had to make a choice...I'm calling it a 'sacrifice'...the definition I refer to is, "Forfeiture of something highly valued for the sake of one considered to have a greater value or claim"...that being the willingness to face that which I avoided by abusing alcohol in order to proceed unencumbered in my spiritual and psychological growth....it was a really tough call because the further I moved in the direction of my psychological development, the more I wanted to drink..I juggled these two things for a while until I saw the pain that my contradicting behaviors was causing me...I would say I want to feel my feelings, know the truth, heal my wounds...I would say that, then the next minute, numbe myself with wine with the soul purpose of not doing that that I knew I needed to do...I knew I couldn't do both at the same time...I HATED to make a choice...it was humiliating and humbling, I really thought that I could manage it...I could with the topamax...it was GREAT!...but I couldn't take the drug indefinitely, it compromised the quality of my daily life by how it made me feel..the buzz just wasn't worth all of that anymore.

I do hold in the back of my head that there will be the day that I'm not as emersed in my spiritual and psychological growth as I am right now..and that I may be able to re-visit moderation at another time..my point to all of this is that when I really got honest with myself, I knew I wasn't disciplined or committed enough to practice moderation because I drank for one reason...and that one reason contradicted everything else that I said I was committed to..I couldn't live with the contradiction anymore. I'm staying open for that day..if it comes, I trust I'll know it, if it doesn't, I'll trust that too. In the meantime, I'm not taking my decision to go Abs as a major revelation, accomplishment or sign of any kind of 'spiritual awakening'..it's come to me very humbly..the only thing I want to remember is the humility, because that I know..from all the spiritual masters, is that humbleness is good..I'll take it...I keep loose track of my time with Abstinence to remember that, and that alone...I don't like the label (I've said this often here I think...) 'alcoholic'..and I don't like the word 'sober'..'sobriety'...all I know is that I don't like being a slave to something that doesn't serve my highest good...drinking didn't serve me and my highest good, so I had to say no..at least until I am a stronger human being...I'm rambling now..forgive me...I'm envious of most of you here that can moderate, your diligence and commitment to one another is awe inspiring...your strength, honesty and courage to walk the path together is beautiful...if alcohol can be turned into an agent that creates these kinds of relaitonships...heLL..it can't be ALL bad, right? :0) Di

[Allie]

Monday 11th December

Hello~

Di -- I love what you said. "I dont like being a slave to something that doesnt serve my highest good." That is so profound. I have felt that way for so long, but never was able to articulate it into words quite that way. I can honestly say that I still feel like a slave, although not nearly to the degree that I was when I first came here. Is there such a thing as a slave with some freedom? I dont know... maybe I have learned enough "good behavior" in this prison now, that I am being allowed some priveleges and freedoms within the prison walls. I dont know, but that statement got me thinking about just how much I am, or am not a slave to this anymore. I have learned to control my amount and stick to my moderation goals with an ease that I never thought possible, but trying to take away my few drinks when I want them is a whole nother story! In other words, I dont feel I could do long term abs, but envy those like you who can. But somehow I feel myself etching slowly towards the day where I will have the strength to.

Meanwhile, all company for the weekend is gone and after staying up till 4 am. with my brother and his wife on Saturday night (although I didnt drink too much), I was exhausted. I was in the bed with lights out by 8:30 last night and slept until 8 this morning, so I feel completely refreshed and like a new person! We all went out for an early dinner with my brother and his family, my sister and her boyfriend and my parents late yesterday afternoon. My sister and I both had one margarita and that was all I had. I was just too darn tired to care about after I got home, so after putting my little one to bed, I was right behind him.

My dillema for the week I guess is that no one in my family knows of the depth of how I have struggled with this in the past, nor of my need to not keep more than what I can handle in the house, I was bombarded with gifts of wine from the entire family on Saturday night. They all went to a wine tasting most of the afternoon, but I couldnt go because I was too busy preparing for 25 to 30 people for dinner, so that was a good distraction. But they all arrived a bit tipsy with many gifts of wine they had bought at the wine tasting, so now I have about 10 bottles of NICE wine here, and hubby just left for a few days out of town, and I just need to not let it get to me. No, I refuse to throw them away, as they are really nice and my goal is to not touch them and save them to open when we have friends stop over or dinner company during the holidays. So I am thinking that I will go ahead and buy my "regular wine" that I like, and if I have that on hand, it will not tempt me to touch the other. This is where it gets tough for me. Plus, I am cramming for this placement test and have devoted this entire week to studying in hopes of being able to be exempt from taking high school refresher courses at college. I dont mind if I land in intermediate Algebra b/c I know if I pass with a C or better, I will get promoted next semester up to College Algebra, which is the only math I am required to take. Anyway, that's my story for now..... I may need a little extra help with the mods and the math this week!! Beth.... be on call in case I have some math questions!! :H Okay, back to multipying and dividing integers.... YUCK!

Allie

[Saint Jude]

Monday 11th December

Morning Everybody!
Wow, great posts posts this morning! I'm not even gonna try to pretend to be eloquent... you all know me better than that! I do admire it though...

I've definately been feeling on the edge of that slippery slope here lately. With battling this wicked cold & trying to "self-medicate", feeling a bit nervous with the holidays & festivities surrounding all of that, and coming up on my one year anniversary of being here... all kinds of mixed emotions and questions going thru my little clogged brain . How's that for a continuing sentence?
Allie- I'm glad you're the one going back to school, & not me! I'd give the proffessors a real run for their $$!

U-oh! The lights are flickering! I'd better post this or I might not have power soon!
Check back later!!
:l , Judie

[Preciouspinot]

Monday 11th December

Allie, I know how you feel about the "good" wine in the house. What works for me is to not store it in the ususal places ie: not in the wine holders or liquor cabinet. This for me is too tempting. Store it in a box in a closet or garage. A cool, dark place that is out of sight out of mind.

[Ivygoodluck]

Monday 11th December

Holiday Mods

Well, Gang,

We are up against some tricky occasions over the next few weeks. I am not drinking wine at home, only out and then my goal is usually two and no more than three wines. But last night there was a little holiday dinner out and I had one margherita and three pinot noirs. I felt fine and had no after effects but was well aware I had upped my intake. I consoled myself that the wines were small glasses, certainly not what I would have poured for myself when I was drinking at home! I have two parties this coming weekend. One is at my house. So that will be the first time I'm drinking at home in a month.

I need some support about that one. Friday night! Big test.

All the best guys,

Ivy