Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

[DadNeedsWisdom]

:new:

Care for a story?

I'm sharing it so that you can help me on a couple of pretty tough questions I'm mulling over right now.

I'm doing my best to not enable my drinking spouse, scare or endanger my kids, under react or over react...

I trust my beautiful wife of 15 years in every area...except on the other side of two drinks. Then it becomes a confusing nightmare. Will she stop at 2? How many more today? Will she say something hurtful? Will she get "silly" and hurt herself? Will she recall how STUPID she sounded tomorrow when she wakes up?

It's finally come to head...I think...I hope...

She got a DWI with two of our kids in the car a month ago (a day I thank God for oddly enough because she claims it was a wake up call). She tested at .23 with child endangerment. This otherwise amazing woman is now "in the system". Her response speaks volumes of her because 95% of the time she's humble, contrite, and seems to have hit her bottom, but...

The other 5% of the time (after 3 drinks) she accuses me of not "getting it" trying to manipulate her, and even accusing me of being most of the reason she drinks. She's told me several times (all while drunk) that I should just leave her and she will be just fine (she always says later after sobering up that she doesn't mean it while rolling her eyes and saying that I'm too sensitive and should know that people say things they don't mean during fights all the time). It really does hurt though. Every time.

She despises the word "alcoholic" but is convinced that I and everyone that actually loves her (as defined by the people that would walk a thousand miles to save her) also think she's an alcoholic. I have no idea if she is though and no matter how obvious it is or isn't to others I know that it's useless information for us to decide what her "condition" is or isn't. I've never called her an alcoholic though nor am I aware of anyone that knows her that has assigned that label to her. She seems fixated on that though...almost too much.

I do know that when she says "I'm bored" it's code for "I'd like to be drinking now and I'm going to start drinking asap". She claims to be bored a lot.

I do know that it's rare that she drinks only one and it's even more rare that she doesn't drink in a day.

I do know that the only friends that she likes are drinkers (all on the heavier side). Most of them have not spoken much with her since the DWI though. Isn't that a clue for all the heavy drinkers? Who actually loves you?

I do know that she is under a huge amount of stress and denial about past difficulties and circumstances that life has thrown at us. These are the real issues she needs to fight through I'm pretty sure, but she seems uninterested in confronting those...she'd rather have a few drinks (she always calls it "a drink") and "get some good sleep tonight for a change".

I do know that 99% of her drinking is done alone. She hates that I won't drink with her, but has seemingly given up on that fight and is perfectly content to drink alone. I haven't drank a drop since her DWI 2 months ago and I don't plan to ever again. I hate alcohol right now. Maybe I always will. It stole my childhood too (another story you've heard before - two alcoholic parents until I was 10 but now they are clean and sober and I'm crying on their hurting shoulders over the phone every few days). Before her DWI I drank 2-3 drinks per month all with her and she resented that too (because I never drank enough).

I do know that when she's drinking she claims she's acting "normal" long after the effects of alcohol have kicked in. She hated when I pointed that out the next day so I've long ago stopped doing that. I've learned my lesson there (I hope). I need to let natural consequences kick in and take care of that on its own. Our five year old asking her if she was drunk while they were being silly did more to drive the point home than anything I could ever say.

If there are folks that care to hear the questions I have I'll post more, but for now my two biggest questions (this may sound silly, but I'm serious) are:

Since she has no license and can't go out and buy alcohol should I be "trusting" her and buying it for her when I'm out and it's convenient for me? Right now I'm not and I've told her to get her own because I hate the stuff (because of my childhood I say). She acts like it's not a big deal that I won't buy it, but I don't know if I'm doing the right thing. She's my wife...not my 16 year old right? What do I do? What are my options?

That was the easy question...

Here's the hard one...

At what point are my kids in danger?
Where are the lines in the sand on that one?
I know no one can give specific answers to that one, but that's where I'm at. I don't think she would do anything to ever intentionally hurt any of them. She is actually quite amazing with them, but she's proven she is capable of making horrible decisions on the other side of 2 drinks. How do I keep from being her "moderator" while still protecting my kids?
At what point am I the irresponsible one?

Any advice or experience welcome...

[tawnyfrog]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

Holy heck.

I don't have any answers for you right now. I'm still digesting your words but I really need to acknowledge your post. That would have been difficult to write.

I'm hearing you. Welcome.

[DadNeedsWisdom]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

Holy Heck!

:H

That's the best laugh I've had in a few days.

I can tell I really like you.

Holy Heck...I love it.

My hope is in my one true God. I've got good friends, great family and feel strong.

I'm ok (most of the time)...just looking for suggestions or wisdom in the counsel of many...

[tawnyfrog]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

Hey - I'm sure the wise ones will chime in shortly with their counsel.

Glad I could provide some comic relief...

[Boss.man]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

Wow! This is tough.

Danger to the kids; I'd say yes if she's drinking and driving. But so is driving and being on the phone, and lots of folk do that too. Enabling by buying a alcohol, I'd say no. Work on enabling compensation, buy her ice cream, desserts, sweet stuff and also complex carbs (think oatmeal). That helps cravings a lot and takes the brain off of drinking.

Alcohol is pleasurable because it tickles a reward center in the brain. The particular reward center has to do with achievement in hunting, food, and satiety. So having a drink tickles the pleasure center for killing a woolly mammoth and feeding the family for the month. Yay Spouse! There's a one-way process here, that once someone gets used to the reward, it's very hard to go back (i.e. be non-rewarded).

I wouldn't say you should enable your spouse. However, you have to realize that the pain of withdrawal is incredible. Alcohol withdrawal is not a 24 hour process, and can last from 7-30 days, with relapse issues dominating 3 months to 5 years or more. Without tools or a support system it will cause depression and cravings, which can exhibit later as binges because the underlying reward center got starved.

So don't buy a drink, but continue on this site and elsewhere to supply tools and support. The big change comes from inside, and most of us drinkers got very private about that part early-on in our process. You may want to work on non-verbal communication, private affirmation, and encouragement. Your goal is to help compensate for the empty emotions that comes from a dependence on chemicals, now dealing with the lack of them.

Part of why this site works is that we can write what we would not say. It's clear here from reading, applying change to a person doesn't really work. Real change comes from the person from the inside, and making a true personal commitment. Until that happens you are just beating on a stone. I wish you godspeed in finding the way to grow the change from inside your spouse.

I hope this makes sense, and helps.

[bloggy]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

Oh Gosh- we drinkers put our loved ones in a terrible situation, don't we- but if it is any consolation to you it is not really us doing it- it is the drug.

I have struggled with my drinking for the best part of 30 years (I am 44 now). Until recently I was just about giving up- I had resigned myself to the fact that I couldn't kick it and would probably not make old bones, then I came across information on the Sinclair method- this involves taking a pill (naltrexone) an hour before you are likely to pick up a drink.

It has I believe, saved my life. As long as you take it every time before you drink, eventually the neural pathways that make you want to drink become rewired- drinking no longer has quite the same effect for you- these days I struggle to finish 2 beers.

For a drinker such as your wife, who it seems has not yet hit her bottom I think it could really help her- she doesn't have to stop, but eventually her addiction should just fall away. It is not an overnight process- it takes about 4 months for most drinkers.

There is a lot involved with this which is too long to write here, but you will find a number of threads here on the board- do a search for Sinclair, or Naltrexone.


Maybe you could ask your wife to come on the board? We are not a bad bunch, and there will be plenty of advice here from others who are using Naltrexone in this way, there is also another board at thesinclairmethod.com • Index page .


PS. I don't like the word 'alcoholic' either! I agree I am addicted to alcohol, but 'alcoholic' makes me feel powerless- and we do have power-some of us might need medication to help us, but there are ways to beat it!

[gyco]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

good day to you,think of it like this,would you let her take care of the children,if she had a concusion,cause everytime she drinks thats what she is doing to herself,she doesnt enjoy the drink no more,its a necessity,without it,she would be like child,ask her to stop for a week,you will always be wrong,she will make you feel that way,only cause she knows you care,she is like a time bomb,never no when it will xpolode,i no,im the same way,or was,sometimes you have to lose something.to really understAND,ARE YOU PREPARED FOR THAT,im being harsh with you cause,you deserve the best,for sticking with her,look at the children that drive with her,are you gonna give her the satisfaction of taking them away,too,as far as buying the booze,she will find a way,obviously rite now that is more important then anything else,i wish you well,gyco

[bloggy]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

I agree with Gyco- we will always find a way to get booze.

A friend of mine (dry for 12 years now) used to get someone to steal it from a restaurant where she was working and she would bury it in the garden so her hubby didn't find it.

[gyco]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

i dont mean to sound hurtful but she needs help,its more then the AL,im not a lady but taking care of, and having five kids is not easy,no xcuse to kill youer kids tho,by the way i did the same as her.driving under the influence,with kids in the car,could of killed my kids a few times,think of it like this,the drinking has damaged her brain,the more she drinks,the more the damage,would you let a retarded person drive your car,something to ponder,

[Theme2be]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

My heart was caught by your question of "who really loves her?"

It is those that actually love her, such as you and those that would protect her.

"Actually" is an existing fact.

It is an existing fact that I consider your words of such value, sir.
It is because I wish to protect her and yourself as well
I am in this battle of being called an "Alcoholic". I don't think and hope; I know. And that causes me to think and hope.

It is my interpretation of her words when she says she is "bored or uninterested" that these are diversions for what is sincerely going on.

A question out of respect is , if she is not one in the horrific battle of Alcoholism, what are some other ideas based on the nature of her actions, because they do seem to center on the drink.

I so understand.

It may be because she has experience "the drink" and in its portions "its effect" that she seems uninterested in confronting.
Thus, Boss. mans brilliant and considerate post.
That is the disorder. It takes from the normal reasoning of a beautiful wife, mother and friend and isolates.

Please post more~

In response to your question:

At what point are your kids not in danger under this condition?
At what point are any of those stricken with this affliction not in danger?
At what point are you the irresponsible one?
That overwelmes me because responsibility comes in levels and none mean that you lack of intent.

In regard to your every word and each case scenerio you detailed- it is familiar.
It is recognizable as one senses the distress in your words.

With all considerations to consider may you trust the actuall outcome once this conditon can be arrested.

From my heart~

[gyco]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

good post theme

[DadNeedsWisdom]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

She has only driven with "a couple" drinks in her once since the dwi 2 months ago and I don't think she will again especially not with the kids...That was the angriest I've ever been with her in our 15 years of marriage. I told her that I would do everything in my power to protect our kids including physically stop her with force if necessary. I will do my best to not react with anger again though. I can't imagine that helps things, but she agreed that I should do whatever is necessary to protect them. Is that her way of maybe admitting she has a problem?

I punched a couch during that fight...it's the only time I've ever done something like that. It scared her I think. She realized how serious I was that night. I didn't come close to hitting her though. Would never do that. I'm one of those "cool and collected good in an emergency" sort of guys, but she put our entire family at risk that night though...everything we've built and accomplished could have been over in one night. I was pissed and even though it's been about 6 weeks I'm still dealing with it. THank god it's not a habit or I'd be in a much tougher spot.

I've prepared my mom and dad for a tough phone call that could come at any time to "come get the kids". She has no idea I've done that and I'm definitely calling that the last resort. I will not hold that over her head, but I will do what it takes to protect our beautiful kids and I've told her that already. I don't owe her the details of my "worst case scenario" plan.

Prepared and peaceful...I'm not sure which is harder to do. Never had to work so hard at both at the same time before. It feels a bit like preparing for a very serious impending life threatening battle that may never come.

She spent the night in jail the night of her DWI. It was a huge event for her. She is calling it her bottom. That's an admission of a problem too isn't it? She still can't look at the picture that was in the paper - she never has. It's an awful picture of her "what's the bid deal" expression, but obviously very drunk face... and it's not who I married. Her self esteem is very low from that night still when she realizes that nearly everyone we know now knows and has seen that horrible pic.

I resent that she is being taken from me by the vary substance that stole my childhood. That picture made me sick to my stomach and I've only looked at it once. The image is burned in my brain...every sip she takes brings it back to me. That's not fair to her though. I will love her until my dying breath. I can't change that.

I can imagine her finding a reason to get really mad some night (she can be quite creative) and just leaving to go get drinks, but she has never done that. That's the next cliff for her to jump off of though if she's looking for one...violating her suspended license to go get drinks would be a new low. I'm praying she doesn't.

I'm showing her the steadiest compassion and love that I can. I'm not perfect and I admit it to her frequently. I have a very immature vantage point on alcohol at times. I hated it when she was drinking one or two per week 3 years ago. I'm learning that I'm a text book case of an adult child of alcoholic parents. Control freak at times, manipulative, always trying to rescue and solve, few close friends, amazing leadership abilities (business success) but with little transparency about my problems. I also have intimacy issues (don't show much emotion) and I'm not even sure what that means as I type it (that's a bad sign isn't it?)

All that could drive a spouse to drink couldn't it?

I don't allow that line of thinking though. It's not my fault she drinks. I'm working on me and she's working on her. Like I said earlier 95 percent of the time we have a great life (a bit stressful, but good).

Applying the al-anon "didn't create it, can't control it, can't change it" line of thinking has been very freeing for me...I've found myself crying for no particular reason (when I'm alone) just reciting that quote to myself over and over. I only learned of that concept a few weeks ago and it's done wonders for me.

You should know...it's the middle of the night. WHen I get up in the middle of the night I'm typically in a pretty dark mood and I'm sure it has tainted this post...I'm looking forward to a great day with my family tomorrow. We are actually on vacation right now. Although we all got to see the 4 drinks and buzzed version of my wife for much of the night tonight I'm taking it one day at a time with God's help.

[DadNeedsWisdom]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

...I must say in a separate post how grateful I am to have found you all here. Taking the time to respond means the world to me. I'm not used to pouring my heart out and being heard...it feels good.

:thanks:

[LVT25]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

Dear dad--I really feel for you. I've been on two sides of the spectrum, my parents didn't drink much, but I was married to a guy that had a pretty major problem that only continued to get worse. I think I lived that life because I learned so much about myself when i went to family care treatment when he was in dry out. I also attended a lot of al anon meetings. Have you tried any counseling for yourself? Something else I would recommend is reading "Codependent No More" . As you already know there is not a damn thing we can do for our loved ones until they are good and ready. Sounds like your wife should be with the dwi incident--but she's still not ready to give it up?? All you can do right now is take care of you and your kids--and be prepared for the real bottom when and if it comes--and it sounds like you've done that. Wow- they print your picture in the paper when you get arrested for DWI?

On the other side of the spectrum I found myself with my own little drinking problem. I'm ashamed to admit I did my fair share of drinking and then driving with my kids in the car. I was rarely an out of control drunk--but did have black outs, etc. I had a very close call with the law 1 year ago and that's when I decided I needed to get honest with myself and get real. I don't drink anymore and it's such a relief in so many ways. Have hope that your wife can find her way out soon.

Best wishes to you.

[bloggy]

Five young kids my wife of 15 years is struggling with alcohol

Thanks Theme- I always love reading your posts- you have a beautiful way with words.

DadNW- I have been pondering your post all day- and a couple of things strike me. I am amongst my drinking peers (of which there are many in my town) one of the 'worst'. But after 2 drinks I am pretty still very much me, my guess is what you think are 2 drinks are more like 4 or 5- go out for a meal and sip a couple of glasses of wine? Yes- but in the meantime I go twice to the loo and neck something from my bag.

Five kids take a lot of looking after, I don't have children- but I have five dogs, and they can overwhelm me at times!

My guess is your wife feels overwhelmed, she isn't coping (obviously) and needs her friend (AL as we 'fondly' call him here) to help her through the day.

In answer to your question, I would say your children are not in safe hands- I think that must be said that any of us who drink know we cannot make safe decisions, and notice what is going on when we are drunk. Please don't think they are OK- a drunk person cannot safely look after children.

Another thing was bothering me- as someone else said, if she really doesn't have access to alcohol without you buying it, please be very aware if she is forced to stop suddenly it can be dangerous, even life threatening. Tapering off in a humane manner is a better solution- ideally with the support of an understanding doctor? Sadly some doctors have no understanding of our addiction at all- and can do far more harm than good.

I feel worried that she sounds like she is in some denial yet she is in charge of children.

I don't know how she would take to being pointed in the direction of the forum- not everyone here is an out of control drinker- there are a number of members who realised their drinking was becoming a problem and now 'mod' or drink moderately with success- she could join one of those threads to start- perhaps approaching it that way would make her feel less like she was being persecuted- she did not ask for this- that I know for a fact.